Bottom end is toast - Need Guidance

[Freefallin]

May end up just sending my block to the machinist not sure yet. My buddy has a good point on the Cali shortblock. What is something is broken or not right or something doesnt bolt up to it like the serp. system or whatever.

Just waiting on the prior owner to respond with that he is willing to do for me. Don't want to push him and piss him off, but in the same token he offered to help so I need to hold him accountable. It's all a money thing for me.

Sean

 

[Freefallin]

I cannot find the Boss 302 connecting rods for sale anywhere...anyone know where to buy them?

Sean

 

[Freefallin]

Nevermind, found them on Tasca Fords site. ONly like $185. But I feel like piecing a kit together may be as expensive as just buying a pre-built kit. Thoghts?

What forged pistons and size should I be running with my application? Keep in mind, budget is #1 here.

Sean

 

[Royal96]

I'd like to hear some opinions on best budget forged pistons as well. I was going to go with probe but I talked to a tuner I was interested in using (not anymore, since he was kind of a condescending jerk to me) and he claimed they were junk. I hear people say they have good luck with them though.

As for piecing a kit together vs. buying the parts separate, I think if you do your homework and shop smart, piecing together is going to be cheaper.

 

[Freefallin]

I'd like to hear some opinions on best budget forged pistons as well. I was going to go with probe but I talked to a tuner I was interested in using (not anymore, since he was kind of a condescending jerk to me) and he claimed they were junk. I hear people say they have good luck with them though.

As for piecing a kit together vs. buying the parts separate, I think if you do your homework and shop smart, piecing together is going to be cheaper.

I definitely don't disagree, but since I've never done a bottom end rebuild, I am not sure of the EXACT parts list I will need. I dont really need a crank. so that might save me a couple bucks.

This kit from MMR sounds like a solid deal, but what else regarding gaskets, etc. would I need? Would you guys have them balance everything so it's ready to throw in the block or just have the machine shop balance it all?

http://www.modularmotorsportsracing...age=product_info&cPath=4_5_36&products_id=334

Sean

 

[ScottyDsntKnow]

I cannot find the Boss 302 connecting rods for sale anywhere...anyone know where to buy them?

Sean

Nevermind, found them on Tasca Fords site. ONly like $185. But I feel like piecing a kit together may be as expensive as just buying a pre-built kit. Thoghts?

What forged pistons and size should I be running with my application? Keep in mind, budget is #1 here.

Sean

Depends what you are doing. For a 2V I would go Manley Street Masters all day. 9.5:1 compression and you can beat the shit out of them. For a 4V... same pistons if a PD blower, if NA/Centri/Turbo I'd do Diamond 5.2cc heads (from Modularheadshop) which will yield 9.5:1 compression as well. If you are NA or Nitrous... whatever piston gets you 11:1 and run premium or E85. Diamond flat tops for 4V for that, I forget off the top of my head what dish yields 11:1 for 2V.

Boss rods will be $185 shipped at Tasca or Tousley. Then ARP hardware will bring it to $260-$275. MMR I beams with the ARP hardware are $299. You can also get Terminator Manley H beams for $299 all day but they will also not come with ARP hardware. Your call.

May end up just sending my block to the machinist not sure yet. My buddy has a good point on the Cali shortblock. What is something is broken or not right or something doesnt bolt up to it like the serp. system or whatever.

Just waiting on the prior owner to respond with that he is willing to do for me. Don't want to push him and piss him off, but in the same token he offered to help so I need to hold him accountable. It's all a money thing for me.

Sean

Again, would be very leery of an assembled shortblock secondhand. I get used shit all the time but its never something where I would have to depend on the previous person having actually assembled it correctly.

I definitely don't disagree, but since I've never done a bottom end rebuild, I am not sure of the EXACT parts list I will need. I dont really need a crank. so that might save me a couple bucks.

This kit from MMR sounds like a solid deal, but what else regarding gaskets, etc. would I need? Would you guys have them balance everything so it's ready to throw in the block or just have the machine shop balance it all?

http://www.modularmotorsportsracing...age=product_info&cPath=4_5_36&products_id=334

Sean

Whole kits are always nice but I've found that I can usually put something together for cheaper. You pay for the conveience of kits like the MMR one. Also pieceing together your own kit you get to choose exactly what is used vs a prebuilt kit. You are right, you don't need a crank if you have a good stock crank. Cast crank is good for well over what you (or I) will be making and turning RPM wise. I have half a mind to sell my forged 8 bolt I just picked up if the 8 bolt cast crank in my broken Windsor 2V is good.

 

[ScottyDsntKnow]

im interested to see how much you can pick up an 03/04 cobra irs for

I'm going to try to do a straight up trade with someone for my very low mileage SRA with Steeda LCA/UCA and Steeda installed FRPP 3.73s. That's going to be pretty tempting for someone with an IRS who wants to switch for drag racing. At least IMO. I've seen 99/01 IRSs go for like $500 but those are obviously not the best ones. But... for what I am doing, they would work fine and save $$$ too.

Oh, and I got those heads today. $107 with tax for 99/01 Cobra (99 Continental=identical castings) heads, with cams, valve covers, COP covers and I bet there are 4V COPs under there too. Have not checked yet. They are real dirty and really need an ultrasonic cleaning and decking but that's cheap and not a huge deal. Few rusty valves but I have 128 spare valves from all the free B heads I've gotten. I needed the COP covers and COP valve covers btw. Have a laser etcher at work so I'm going to clean these up real well, paint them, laser etch something in the COP covers and then paint in the etching and clear them. Probably a big STEEDA logo.

 

[Freefallin]

Depends what you are doing. For a 2V I would go Manley Street Masters all day. 9.5:1 compression and you can beat the shit out of them. For a 4V... same pistons if a PD blower, if NA/Centri/Turbo I'd do Diamond 5.2cc heads (from Modularheadshop) which will yield 9.5:1 compression as well. If you are NA or Nitrous... whatever piston gets you 11:1 and run premium or E85. Diamond flat tops for 4V for that, I forget off the top of my head what dish yields 11:1 for 2V.

Boss rods will be $185 shipped at Tasca or Tousley. Then ARP hardware will bring it to $260-$275. MMR I beams with the ARP hardware are $299. You can also get Terminator Manley H beams for $299 all day but they will also not come with ARP hardware. Your call.



Again, would be very leery of an assembled shortblock secondhand. I get used shit all the time but its never something where I would have to depend on the previous person having actually assembled it correctly.



Whole kits are always nice but I've found that I can usually put something together for cheaper. You pay for the conveience of kits like the MMR one. Also pieceing together your own kit you get to choose exactly what is used vs a prebuilt kit. You are right, you don't need a crank if you have a good stock crank. Cast crank is good for well over what you (or I) will be making and turning RPM wise. I have half a mind to sell my forged 8 bolt I just picked up if the 8 bolt cast crank in my broken Windsor 2V is good.

Scott, since you are clearly the right person to ask, can you possibly list out exactly what I would need? You have been a ton of help thus far and I really appreciate it. I like the idea of building my own setup, as I will know exactly what goes into the car so there will be no guesswork.

I am already set on the Boss connecting rods, but don't really know what pistons, bearings, and gaskets to run.

Sean

 

[Freefallin]

This kit from CHP seems to fit the bill:
http://www.coasthigh.com/Ford-4-6L-2V-Dish-Top-18-1cc-Street-Fighter-Kit-p/10178-sf-2v.htm

I called a machine shop and he said it would be $100 to "grind the crank". Forgive my ignorance, but what exactly is this process and why would it need it? The way I see it is I may as well get the kit if my crank needed this service. Thoughts?

Sean

 

[ScottyDsntKnow]

Except you don't need the crank... The cast nodular iron stock crank you have is good for well over the power level your PI heads will support. Even if it was ported heads or 4V heads you still would be fine with the stock cast crank.

I'd do the Manley Street Masters, the Boss rods, stock crank, your choice of bearings (king or clevites are fine), total seal rings. Fel Pro gaskets all around, ARP hardware, 3V oil pump with Boundary gears and a Stewart water pump.

You'll also need to make sure you have the proper fuel system, a good tune and the right supporting cast for a supercharged modular.

For your question about the crank, that is typically called "turning" the crank. Basically taking .010 off the bearing surfaces to smooth everything out and true it up. This means you'd order .010 bearings for the crank/rods if you had that done. Not call cranks need it.

 

[Freefallin]

Found the pistons, looks like Jegs may have the best price:
http://www.jegs.com/p/Manley/Manley...reet-Master-Dish-Top-Pistons/3151079/10002/-1

 

[ScottyDsntKnow]

Yeah Jegs is my go to place all things being equal. I get a military discount with them too. Those pistons are $485 for me lol. Wish I could run them, too low a compression on a 4V. Those would be the ones I would use on a 2V TBTH. Just remember those specific ones are .020 and .030 over. You really do not want to go more than .020 over on a modular.

 

[lwarrior1016]

Yeah Jegs is my go to place all things being equal. I get a military discount with them too. Those pistons are $485 for me lol. Wish I could run them, too low a compression on a 4V. Those would be the ones I would use on a 2V TBTH. Just remember those specific ones are .020 and .030 over. You really do not want to go more than .020 over on a modular.

How do you get military discount with Jegs? I need to do this! lol

 

[Freefallin]

Yeah Jegs is my go to place all things being equal. I get a military discount with them too. Those pistons are $485 for me lol. Wish I could run them, too low a compression on a 4V. Those would be the ones I would use on a 2V TBTH. Just remember those specific ones are .020 and .030 over. You really do not want to go more than .020 over on a modular.

Yeah, I would make sure to order the stockers. However, I was thinking the block may nee to be bored. Any way to check when I get the top end off or will a machinist just have to measure it?

I am going to put together an Excel spreadsheet tonight with all part #'s and prices so I can get a solid idea of where I stand. The prior owner who is going to help me out says he needs to chat with his old lady but should have an idea of what he can contribute hopefully this weekend.

I dont have an engine stand or picker, but does anyone have a good writeup on how to remove my motor? Do I need any special fuel line removal tools or anything? This is a large undertaking for someone has never done it I assume?

I hate waiting for shit like this. If I only had $2500....

Sean

 

[ScottyDsntKnow]

How do you get military discount with Jegs? I need to do this! lol

I emailed them and a rep contacted me. I scanned and emailed my ID from my military email account and I made an account on the Jegs website. They added a mil discount to my Jegs account after they confirmed everything. I think its only 5% or something small and not on everything but its still cool that they do it at all. Always go Jegs if I can. Everyone always nutswings on AM/LRS/CJP and as good as those guys are, they don't hold a candle to Jegs and Summit.

 

[ScottyDsntKnow]

Yeah, I would make sure to order the stockers. However, I was thinking the clock may nee to be bored. Any way to check when I get the top end off or will a machinist just have to measure it?

I am going to put together an Excel spreadsheet tonight with all part #'s and prices so I can get a solid idea of where I stand. The prior owner who is going to help me out says he needs to chat with his old lady but should have an idea of what he can contribute hopefully this weekend.

I hate waiting for shit like this. If I only had $2500....

Sean

You can measure the bores yourself but its best to have a shop do it.

I wish I had the $2500 for a forged bottom end too... that's why I've started flipping parts like crazy and looking for parts that are not the "best" according to the e-racers on the internets or off a non-mustang platform. Example is those C heads I just got. They're off a Continental and they were next to nothing... but they are the same as 99/01 Cobra heads. And my block. WAP block, everyone on the internet thinks they blow up at 500-600hp, not true. I got mine already done .020 over and ready to go for $300 because everyone wants a Teksid or Aluminator. Just the block should cost more than that and machine work $600-$700. I get $250-$350 for a Teksid that needs a rebuild... Like I said, deals are out there if you are patient and willing to look. Just something to think about if you are short of funds and can find some good deals to turn into profit.

 

[Freefallin]

Prior owner says he will get back to me over the weekend but shockingly I have yet to hear back from him. Still playing the waiting game....

 

[ScottyDsntKnow]

He may have sold it locally... he might really really really not want to palletize it and go through the problem of shipping it. Just moving a motor around like that can be a pain in the ass. Especially the mega heavy termi motor.

 

[Freefallin]

He may have sold it locally... he might really really really not want to palletize it and go through the problem of shipping it. Just moving a motor around like that can be a pain in the ass. Especially the mega heavy termi motor.

I was referring to the fact that I am waiting on the prior owner of the Mustang to see how much he can help me out with a bottom end. I shot him a text the minute we found out bottom end was gone and he called later on. Said he felt terrible and wants to do everything he can to help. Not sure if this means he is going to take care of the entire thing or what. This is the only thing I am waiting on, as I do not have the money to do any of it at the moment.

Sean

 

[Freefallin]

Update:

Prior owner says he can send me $1k to help out but I am still in a holding pattern on how he can get the cash to me. I texted him this morning and he said "working on this as we speak". I guess I don't understand how it can take this long to decide which method of funding to go with.

Sean