Breaking Loose Head Bolts: To use or not to use?

[from6to8]

some things I read on google people were saying not to use a deep wall socket but I don't see how you can get around it because using just a standard socket, for me the breaker bar and pipe is resting near the studs or the side of the head and i am positioned to where i have good enough leverage to break it loose. Using a regular socket will indeed be a task and so I am not going to mess with it anymore tonite but in the morning I will be back at it so what is you guy's position on having had used a deep wall before to break the bolts loose? And basically I'm talking about the lower head bolts but there are some inside the heads as well thats cutting it close to hitting the studs using a regular socket.

Also had to use a dawgone 4 ft piece of pipe to get good leverage standing outside of the car. Using a short pipe would be dreadful on the back........SMH

Also, does the power steering pump pulley have to be pulled off with a puller? After getting that off there are a few more bolts right behind the pulley that has to come off before moving the PW pump out of the way?

 

[DeepList]

some things I read on google people were saying not to use a deep wall socket but I don't see how you can get around it because using just a standard socket, for me the breaker bar and pipe is resting near the studs or the side of the head and i am positioned to where i have good enough leverage to break it loose. Using a regular socket will indeed be a task and so I am not going to mess with it anymore tonite but in the morning I will be back at it so what is you guy's position on having had used a deep wall before to break the bolts loose? And basically I'm talking about the lower head bolts but there are some inside the heads as well thats cutting it close to hitting the studs using a regular socket.

Also had to use a dawgone 4 ft piece of pipe to get good leverage standing outside of the car. Using a short pipe would be dreadful on the back........SMH

I just use a good quality ratchet and standard socket with a big ass breaker bar. I've never had any issues breaking the head bolts loose.

Also, does the power steering pump pulley have to be pulled off with a puller? After getting that off there are a few more bolts right behind the pulley that has to come off before moving the PW pump out of the way?

On the 5.0 engines, the power steering pump is mounted to a bracket that is bolted to the engine. You'll have to take the pulley off before you can access the pump to bracket bolts.

 

[from6to8]

I just use a good quality ratchet and standard socket with a big ass breaker bar. I've never had any issues breaking the head bolts loose.



On the 5.0 engines, the power steering pump is mounted to a bracket that is bolted to the engine. You'll have to take the pulley off before you can access the pump to bracket bolts.

do u know rather the pulley has to be pulled off

 

[CC'S95GT]

I think someone on here a while back used a dremel tool to route out a part of the pulley to allow the socket to reach that bolt without having to remove the pulley.
It's been a while since I've seen it. He also said there was no vibrations afterwards.

 

[99GreenStang]

ok i dont know if im just strong or what but i used a regular 1/2 drive craftsman ratchet and broke loose every bolt on my engine by hand with no breakers lol. but this also may be why i have back problems ( thinking yeah proble ) my power steering pump is mounted to the head bolt itself im using a march performance kit it has plenty of room just an idea not sure if its relevant . also if you had the money I would buy new just because its one of those things , but people have built motors for years reusing parts and bolts and they have ran forever . kinda falls on hunting now days they sell a compound bow that shoots 355fps and people think you 'need that ' to kill anything indians killed for years with a recurve not shooting anywhere near that . my point is you dont need new to make things work. good luck

 

[from6to8]

ok i dont know if im just strong or what but i used a regular 1/2 drive craftsman ratchet and broke loose every bolt on my engine by hand with no breakers lol. but this also may be why i have back problems ( thinking yeah proble ) my power steering pump is mounted to the head bolt itself im using a march performance kit it has plenty of room just an idea not sure if its relevant . also if you had the money I would buy new just because its one of those things , but people have built motors for years reusing parts and bolts and they have ran forever . kinda falls on hunting now days they sell a compound bow that shoots 355fps and people think you 'need that ' to kill anything indians killed for years with a recurve not shooting anywhere near that . my point is you dont need new to make things work. good luck

whats the torque specs for TF aluminum heads?

when u say buy new, what are u referring to?

and from another forum guys said the pulley doesnt have to come off and to just unbolt the three bolts holding the bracket to the head so i will see how that works. i do want to paint the power steering pulley though so might end up taking it off and might be easier to take it off while the bracket is still bolted to head so will inspect to see rather I can tell which way will be easier

 

[DeepList]

from another forum guys said the pulley doesnt have to come off and to just unbolt the three bolts holding the bracket to the head so i will see how that works. i do want to paint the power steering pulley though so might end up taking it off and might be easier to take it off while the bracket is still bolted to head so will inspect to see rather I can tell which way will be easier

If you want to keep the pulley intact, it needs to come off. If you don't have the tool to get it off, you can rent it from AutoZone or some other auto parts store.

 

[RichV]

You can get the bracket off without removing the pulley. I've had the motor/heads off my race car more times than I'd like to admit. I also pulled the pulley off the 1st time but found out you can do it without removing it. 2 of the 3 bracket bolts are easy, the 3rd is just right below the p/s pulley. You'll have to use a 9/16" (IIRC) open end wrench and ease it out while holding the bracket. Once that bolt runs out of thread the bracket drops, you cannot get that bolt off the bracket because the p/s pulley is in the way. Re-install with that bolt 1st.

You think the head bolts are a PITA, taking that p/s pulley off is a pain. I broke a pulley puller on mine, was ready to just use a stick of dynamite.

 

[from6to8]

You can get the bracket off without removing the pulley. I've had the motor/heads off my race car more times than I'd like to admit. I also pulled the pulley off the 1st time but found out you can do it without removing it. 2 of the 3 bracket bolts are easy, the 3rd is just right below the p/s pulley. You'll have to use a 9/16" (IIRC) open end wrench and ease it out while holding the bracket. Once that bolt runs out of thread the bracket drops, you cannot get that bolt off the bracket because the p/s pulley is in the way. Re-install with that bolt 1st.

You think the head bolts are a PITA, taking that p/s pulley off is a pain. I broke a pulley puller on mine, was ready to just use a stick of dynamite.

yeah i want to paint it so i need to get the pulley out of the engine bay so if removing it leaving it on the bracket will get it ALL out of the engine bay then i leave the pulley on. I am about to go mess with the car for a few hrs before the game comes on but my first order is getting off the pass side head which that is where the spring broke so i will get to the d side head tommorow.

It cant be no harder than the harmonic balancer right lol?

What do you guys think about painting the headers with the highest quality and best paint? Others say on other forums it will still burn off no matter what

 

[from6to8]

im guessing to send a file i need to use something like tiny pic so i can get the url?

i dont see a manage attachments tab

 

[DeepList]

im guessing to send a file i need to use something like tiny pic so i can get the url?

Correct

 

[KillNThrill24]

All these people having issues breaking head bolts I just be like... Hit the gym yo...


Haha no seriously tho its all in the leverage. I realize I have a 4.6 but same concept... leverage is your friend. Get the breaker bar in a position where you can really push up on it with your shoulder if necessary.... And I hope you know what I mean by that... I've never had any issues cracking head bolts at any angle but I can understand how some people may. Utilize the leverage! And I always used a deep well socket to clear everything so I don't see what the issue is there?

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

 

[from6to8]

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And my question is with no cracks in that piston, would just sanding the scratch/scuffs with scotchbrite or sandpaper lightly be sufficient?

can I check the rings by pouring oil in the cylinder walls and seeing how fast it takes to leak down? I thought someone mentioned that before lol

 

[from6to8]

All these people having issues breaking head bolts I just be like... Hit the gym yo...


Haha no seriously tho its all in the leverage. I realize I have a 4.6 but same concept... leverage is your friend. Get the breaker bar in a position where you can really push up on it with your shoulder if necessary.... And I hope you know what I mean by that... I've never had any issues cracking head bolts at any angle but I can understand how some people may. Utilize the leverage! And I always used a deep well socket to clear everything so I don't see what the issue is there?

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

oh trust me thats one thing i have learned over the years and it worked out fine. Got all bolts off the pass side head with success with the exception of the far bolt near windshield where the heater core hoses were in the way and didnt think they would stop the bar from moving smoothly but it ended up stripping the corners of the bolt some so im sure i will need to get one new bolt. I have ARP's that i bought back in 05 and they look fine. I will also just next time move EVERYTHING out of the way including those heater hoses. Everything else by the way was out of the way though

 

[from6to8]

I think someone on here a while back used a dremel tool to route out a part of the pulley to allow the socket to reach that bolt without having to remove the pulley.
It's been a while since I've seen it. He also said there was no vibrations afterwards.

On the head well actually on the block itself I believe the old gasket all came off with the head and basically it looks like there really ain't any gasket material on the block itself but the coloration of the gasket is still there of course so should I basically do like I do when I clean the bottom of the intake and block for the intake gaskets just use a razor blade and get as much as I can off or whatever and then use like a scotch brite pad too lightly get the surfaces

 

[from6to8]

I just use a good quality ratchet and standard socket with a big ass breaker bar. I've never had any issues breaking the head bolts loose.



On the 5.0 engines, the power steering pump is mounted to a bracket that is bolted to the engine. You'll have to take the pulley off before you can access the pump to bracket bolts.

Do any of you guys know if when i loosen the 3 bolts holding the power steering pump bracket, will that pull off the entire bracket? I know it will pull the pulley off with it but i wanted to paint the pulley so was wondering if loosening those 3 bolts would allow me to remove the entire bracket from under the hood

 

[Addermk2]

Do any of you guys know if when i loosen the 3 bolts holding the power steering pump bracket, will that pull off the entire bracket? I know it will pull the pulley off with it but i wanted to paint the pulley so was wondering if loosening those 3 bolts would allow me to remove the entire bracket from under the hood

There are three inverted torx bolts that hold the pump to the bracket... Then there are three hex bolts that hold the bracket to the head.

 

[from6to8]

There are three inverted torx bolts that hold the pump to the bracket... Then there are three hex bolts that hold the bracket to the head.

forgot i havent put pics up here because i have to go thru tiny pic first but first chance i get i will

Ok guys I just sent some pics to this guy I have been talking to from Texas. He seems to be real knowledgeable and I can tell from talking to him on the phone several times and for an extended time, he seems to be the type that's pretty much a stickler if that's the correct word, he seems to know what he's talking about. So here are his thoughts on getting the heads fixed. I will copy and paste them thru my fone cause it will be easier so i just want to see what you guys will think, and opinions further:

cleaning the heads up and bolting on that oil coked short block is Not gonna happen, man. That short block has to come out. The hone is coked with microscopic oil, so ring seal AND oil control is done bc once a hone is coked, it's pores are seal shut with burned oil. The only way that cleans up is with a fresh hone and rings. Besides that, it's not gonna make any power until you solve the coked hone. ;-)

Bc ring seal is done, as a result.

To anyone who will say to you that what I said is not the case, all I can say is this: After you put the heads back on, take a look at a leak down gauge and after having done so, tell me it isn't the case. LOL

 

[MustangChris]

tell tell you to use a standard socket in order to reduce the chance of you rolling the bolt head.

Most head bolts are TTY, stretched when installed, and they go through a rough life. If you roll a head-bolt head you're in a world of hurt getting it out.

Using a standard socket shortens the leverage on the socket when turning on it.

The same concept should be used when TIGHTENING head bolts. Use the shortest amount of "stuff" possible to ensure an accurate TQ reading. Extensions absorb torque and change the force put onto the bolt. Avoid using deep sockets and extensions when installing heads, whenever possible.

My uncle (who helped me build my mustang) used to have a series of extensions for work on lug nuts. His TQ wrench was set to a certain setting (say, 100 FT/LB) and they had color coded extensions that were different lengths, made from different metals, to shift the setting lower. So, a blue extension + green extension would remove 5 FT/LB. So, grab your TQ wrench and a green+blue and you KNOW you're at 95 ft/lb.


anyways, .... ..

 

[from6to8]

tell tell you to use a standard socket in order to reduce the chance of you rolling the bolt head.

Most head bolts are TTY, stretched when installed, and they go through a rough life. If you roll a head-bolt head you're in a world of hurt getting it out.

Using a standard socket shortens the leverage on the socket when turning on it.

The same concept should be used when TIGHTENING head bolts. Use the shortest amount of "stuff" possible to ensure an accurate TQ reading. Extensions absorb torque and change the force put onto the bolt. Avoid using deep sockets and extensions when installing heads, whenever possible.

My uncle (who helped me build my mustang) used to have a series of extensions for work on lug nuts. His TQ wrench was set to a certain setting (say, 100 FT/LB) and they had color coded extensions that were different lengths, made from different metals, to shift the setting lower. So, a blue extension + green extension would remove 5 FT/LB. So, grab your TQ wrench and a green+blue and you KNOW you're at 95 ft/lb.


anyways, .... ..

Yeah I have learned over the years that it's all about leverage...leverage.....leverage . I actually got them all of fine with the exception of one bolt, the one back near heater core hoses that i eventually took one of the hoses. The bolt came off fine but just rounded some of the corner of the bolt off and it might even be fine to re-use but will get opinions on it and if i use it it will be placed at the first bolt hole. They are ARP bolts by the way

when i do work i make sure i will be in the correct posture position so i will be able to get good leverage and always hold the socket on the bolt to make sure I have it on there nice and straight on the bolt before attempting to break