Casper the Cobra - Procharged 96' Cobra

[Venompower]

So Teksid blocks are pretty easy to come by in the Chicagoland Area on FB Marketplace. I'm likely going to pick one up this winter, and have the block gone through by a local machine shop. I would like to add forged rods and pistons, and then refresh the heads and use my crank and cams. This will be the largest project I've ever tackled, and I would love help from all of you. Probably run a 3.4 pulley on the P1-SC until I can upgrade down the road to a D1-SC/D1X... shooting for 550-600hp.

I would love your help getting started by assisting me in putting together a "shopping" list of what I'm going to need to do this. What ARP bolts/studs, oil pump, recommended gaskets, rods, pistons, etc. I'd like to start stockpiling this stuff over time, so that it's not such a financial hit all at once. I don't have the money to have the engine shop completely assemble the engine, so once I get the shortblock, I'll need help going through the assembly process at that point.

Just want to say thanks in advance, the car wouldn't be running as well as it currently is without the help everyone has provided.

 

[jfisher]

I would personally start watching this guys videos from the very beginning (mod motor engine related videos that is) and just get a solid understanding of how everything works.

https://www.youtube.com/c/JohnSmithRacing/videos

What you should do is a really loaded question that I think comes down to budget, goals and how much of the project you want to do yourself. There are a lot of nuances to these and every book I read didn't hold a candle to the JSR videos above. A quality, well built, forged 4.6 DOHC is easily a $10-15k build. I, luckily, got my engine for next to nothing and had it checked out by a machine shop to make sure everything was done correctly.

I would definitely look at upgraded timing chain guide pins and Wonder Racing modified primary chain tensioners. Two important "while you're in there" items. I used OEM Ford HG's, ARP everything, etc etc.

I would really consider a Coyote swap if I were you. They're really not that bad for cars already setup for mod motors.

 

[Venompower]

I would personally start watching this guys videos from the very beginning (mod motor engine related videos that is) and just get a solid understanding of how everything works.

https://www.youtube.com/c/JohnSmithRacing/videos

What you should do is a really loaded question that I think comes down to budget, goals and how much of the project you want to do yourself. There are a lot of nuances to these and every book I read didn't hold a candle to the JSR videos above. A quality, well built, forged 4.6 DOHC is easily a $10-15k build. I, luckily, got my engine for next to nothing and had it checked out by a machine shop to make sure everything was done correctly.

I would definitely look at upgraded timing chain guide pins and Wonder Racing modified primary chain tensioners. Two important "while you're in there" items. I used OEM Ford HG's, ARP everything, etc etc.

I would really consider a Coyote swap if I were you. They're really not that bad for cars already setup for mod motors.

I'm going to have to disagree that a quality forged 4.6 DOHC aiming for 550-600whp is a $10-$15k build.

 

[cobrajeff96]

Yes and yes. I went down that road more than a few years back. To get a Teskid to be on par or just slightly greater in power output than a Coyote didn't justify the price. I wanted a capable set of internals for my OEM Teskid but the numbers just didn't make sense when I could just swap in a Yote and call it a day, plus the OEM reliability (with a few select insurance mods of course) of the Coyote was key. And pound for pound the Yote wins in power output.

 

[Venompower]

Yes and yes. I went down that road more than a few years back. To get a Teskid to be on par or just slightly greater in power output than a Coyote didn't justify the price. I wanted a capable set of internals for my OEM Teskid but the numbers just didn't make sense when I could just swap in a Yote and call it a day, plus the OEM reliability (with a few select insurance mods of course) of the Coyote was key. And pound for pound the Yote wins in power output.

What were you quoted? I'm not saying Coyote swaps aren't desirable, but they are more complex and more money, then having forged rods and pistons added to a short block. It all depends on what your goals are... again for 550-600whp I don't need a Coyote.

 

[cobrajeff96]

It was in 2014 I think. I wasn't shooting for moon boosting the Teskid but I wanted more power and reliability with it. Quotes I was getting from different places was more than the cost of just buying a full Coyote crate at the time. So they are not always more money, and really it depends on how you implement it into the overall car. For instance, the OEM feed line can be used as the swap's return line, etc. Some people do battery relo, some don't. It's your own palette and some go hog wild with it.

To me the choice was clear: make 450hp as-is with a brand new, warrantied crate.... or have a Teskid essentially fully rebuilt to my spec for a good deal more money with no warranty, less mpg, less streetability, and less overall capability.

 

[lwarrior1016]

Price out forged pistons, forged rods, total seal rings, clevite or king rod and main bearings, arp rod bolts, arp main bolts, arp head studs, arp harmonic balancer bolt, billet oil pump (I’d recommend going to a 3v/gt500 pump with 15/16” pickup tube, then all the gaskets.

This will kind of be a base line for parts.

Now you have to ask, does the block need to be bored or decked or align honed. All that will add machining cost. You’ll have to get the rotating assembly balanced. Then, how much if the assembly are you going to do? Do you have the tooling to set ring gaps or check/adjust bearing clearances? Do you have necessary torque wrenches needed?

If you don’t have those tools, the machine shop will be assembling it. That will drive price up. I can easily see you having $3-4k in parts, then whatever the machine shop is going to charge. Don’t be surprised if you hear $8k for all this.

I am not trying to discourage this by any means, just trying to throw some reality out there.

 

[Venompower]

Price out forged pistons, forged rods, total seal rings, clevite or king rod and main bearings, arp rod bolts, arp main bolts, arp head studs, arp harmonic balancer bolt, billet oil pump (I’d recommend going to a 3v/gt500 pump with 15/16” pickup tube, then all the gaskets.

This will kind of be a base line for parts.

Now you have to ask, does the block need to be bored or decked or align honed. All that will add machining cost. You’ll have to get the rotating assembly balanced. Then, how much if the assembly are you going to do? Do you have the tooling to set ring gaps or check/adjust bearing clearances? Do you have necessary torque wrenches needed?

If you don’t have those tools, the machine shop will be assembling it. That will drive price up. I can easily see you having $3-4k in parts, then whatever the machine shop is going to charge. Don’t be surprised if you hear $8k for all this.

I am not trying to discourage this by any means, just trying to throw some reality out there.

I mean you were the one who encouraged me to tear the engine apart for head gaskets lol. I’d imagine the machine work will be $1,500…. I’m picking up a second engine so that mine isn’t down so I have time to do this and accumulate parts over time.

Sounds like I can get a full Mark 8 Teksid with Manley rods/ arp rod bolts for around $600.

 

[lwarrior1016]

I mean you were the one who encouraged me to tear the engine apart for head gaskets lol. I’d imagine the machine work will be $1,500…. I’m picking up a second engine so that mine isn’t down so I have time to do this and accumulate parts over time.

Sounds like I can get a full Mark 8 Teksid with Manley rods/ arp rod bolts for around $600.

That’s not a bad price, but does that have the 8 bolt forged crank like your current engine? Do the pistons match the specs you need?

 

[Venompower]

That’s not a bad price, but does that have the 8 bolt forged crank like your current engine? Do the pistons match the specs you need?

The connecting rods aren’t in the engine. It’s a project a fellow Mustang club member never followed up on… I really don’t need all of it but the price is right. The crank is not forged so I would either use mine once I have all the parts or just source another. The exhaust cams are the same but I would need to use my intake cams or source new ones. Have a lead on some .030 over DSS forged pistons for $350.

 

[NXcoupe]

Just read your thread. I like your cobra.
Head gaskets are not an issue on 96 to 04 modulars.
Look on ebay for used set of 03/04 cobra manley rods. Usually 350 and better than the chinese crap.
Never align hone a modular engine unless it has torque plates bolted to both banks. The head bolts go into the main webbing and distort the main bores when torqued, so if it is align honed without it, it will be distorted when the heads are torqued.
I build a lot of modular high hp engines as well as coyotes. Coyotes are a better hp per dollar spent investment. Jmho. You do already have a blower set up and other peripherals that make a mild build of the modular cost effective so I would go that route.
Whatever route you take, I'll be followimg along. Good luck!

 

[Venompower]

Just read your thread. I like your cobra.
Head gaskets are not an issue on 96 to 04 modulars.
Look on ebay for used set of 03/04 cobra manley rods. Usually 350 and better than the chinese crap.
Never align hone a modular engine unless it has torque plates bolted to both banks. The head bolts go into the main webbing and distort the main bores when torqued, so if it is align honed without it, it will be distorted when the heads are torqued.
I build a lot of modular high hp engines as well as coyotes. Coyotes are a better hp per dollar spent investment. Jmho. You do already have a blower set up and other peripherals that make a mild build of the modular cost effective so I would go that route.
Whatever route you take, I'll be followimg along. Good luck!

Thanks! That was my thought… with the Procharger, I think I can hit my goals with some minor machine work to add the forged rods and pistons. I’ll be reaching out to a couple machine shops this week.

 

[jfisher]

Price out forged pistons, forged rods, total seal rings, clevite or king rod and main bearings, arp rod bolts, arp main bolts, arp head studs, arp harmonic balancer bolt, billet oil pump (I’d recommend going to a 3v/gt500 pump with 15/16” pickup tube, then all the gaskets.

This will kind of be a base line for parts.

Now you have to ask, does the block need to be bored or decked or align honed. All that will add machining cost. You’ll have to get the rotating assembly balanced. Then, how much if the assembly are you going to do? Do you have the tooling to set ring gaps or check/adjust bearing clearances? Do you have necessary torque wrenches needed?

If you don’t have those tools, the machine shop will be assembling it. That will drive price up. I can easily see you having $3-4k in parts, then whatever the machine shop is going to charge. Don’t be surprised if you hear $8k for all this.

I am not trying to discourage this by any means, just trying to throw some reality out there.

Exactly what I told him in PM. Things start adding up very quickly if you want it to last and want it done right. The ARP hardware alone is $800 for these motors, $500 for oil pump, OEM timing parts are $500 and that's still with the stock guide pins, modified tensioners are $160, windage tray, gaskets, bearings, etc etc and that's not even touching the heads yet. If I'm tearing down the motor this far I would also be doing C heads if it's a street driven car which it sounds like it is. The low end torque is huge. If I didn't get my engine and parts so cheap I would have just done a Coyote swap. Cheaper and a much more stout platform to start with even with a Gen 1.

 

[jfisher]

Thanks! That was my thought… with the Procharger, I think I can hit my goals with some minor machine work to add the forged rods and pistons. I’ll be reaching out to a couple machine shops this week.

You'll want more than "minor" machine work to add rods and pistons. New pistons and rods will need to be balanced with the crank, you'll need all new bearings, hardware.

 

[Venompower]

I’ve already had a quote for $3,500 to forge my short block if I did nothing more than drop it off at the machine shop. It’s not going to cost $10k-$15k, I'm hoping to lower that cost by sourcing some of my own parts to drop off with the block.

For reference what would a coyote swap cost… including swap headers, engine management, etc. I’m open to all options I just have a hard time believing a coyote would be cheaper.

 

[apsmith49921]

What about using Coyote rods? It's another good budget options.

Edit: pistons are gone

 

[Venompower]

What about using Coyote rods? It's another good budget options. I actually might know a guy with some manley 20 over pistons. I forget the dish but good for boost

The cheaper I can get parts the easier the whole build will be! Can’t get cheap machine work lol.

 

[apsmith49921]

Sorry had to edit my post he sold em

 

[cobrajeff96]

Depends on what kind of Yote setup you're after. Some people have picked them up for as little as a couple grand. Every situation is different. Some people find junked S197s/S550s and pull as much as they can out of them, get the PCMs to work, etc., etc. It's a haul and a chore but people have been known to do swaps like this for hella cheap, certainly cheaper than what you're looking at when it's all said and done.

 

[Venompower]

Depends on what kind of Yote setup you're after. Some people have picked them up for as little as a couple grand. Every situation is different. Some people find junked S197s/S550s and pull as much as they can out of them, get the PCMs to work, etc., etc. It's a haul and a chore but people have been known to do swaps like this for hella cheap, certainly cheaper than what you're looking at when it's all said and done.

I’ll be happy to keep a log and post receipts when it’s all said and done. I don’t want to out a 100k mile Coyote in my car… and lower mileage Coyotes are $5k plus for engine alone…