E85 conversion?

ryansgts · Apr 16, 2020

So I’ve been looking into e85 conversions for my 2000 mustang gt with almost no luck. I’ve seen Dyno numbers and a bunch of conflicting info but that’s about it. Some say just fill it up with e85 and tune it, some say I need a bigger fuel pump, injectors, switch to braided lines, and a tune. Is anyone here running e85 on an n/a 4.6 2v? If so, what are you running for fuel pump and injectors? Right now I have 4.10 rear end, cai, bbk headers, bbk h pipe, Borla cat back, built t56 6 speed. I will be going turbo next winter and trying to get some supporting mods done now to get ready

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

01yellercobra · Apr 16, 2020

Yes, you need bigger pumps and injectors to run E85. It takes about 30% more volume to run it. So depending on your power goals figure 60lb injectors minimum. 80's would probably be better. I'd recommend upgrading to a dual pump set up as well. What's the overall power goal? In my case I'm running a full return system with -8 for feed and return. It should be good for about 800hp on a PD blower. A turbo isn't as hard on a fuel system though.

I know quite a few people running E85 on stock lines with no issues.

And yes, you need a tune for it. IMO it's not worth it on a stock N/A 2V. I wouldn't run it on an N/A 4V either. But that's me.

ryansgts · Apr 16, 2020

So I’m not doubting you but 19 lb is stock and 30 percent increase, how do you get to 80 lb? And that’s kind a hard question to answer. For this summer I’d like to get to 300 at the wheels. This winter I’m pulling the engine and building it for turbo with a goal of 600-700. I’m trying to build it so I don’t buy parts and then replace them with different parts when I go turbo so it might not be feasible to go e85 right now but I’m hoping it is and can’t find enough info to decide.
And it’s only na for now, it will be turbo, I’m just trying to figure out if I can do that now to get ready and spread the cost out a little without wasting money on parts now just to replace them later

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

evilcw311 · Apr 16, 2020

If your going turbo then on pump you’d be looking no less the 48’s. But your wanting e85 so then 60 would be minimum with no room to grow. The boost bug bites hard and you’ll want to turn it up which means you’ll need the 80’s. It’s better to go bigger and be able to back it off on the time rather than having your injectors running at 100% and leave you no room for error.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ryansgts · Apr 16, 2020

So I’m not sure if it’s true but I’ve heard running too big of injectors or fuel pump can actually cause a loss of power. So if I went with a big pump and injectors, would I be losing power until I go turbo?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

white95 · Apr 16, 2020

You don’t want to match your injectors to the exact fuel demand. You want to leave some duty cycle “headspace” so they’re not maxed out. This leaves some room for growth and also helps them last longer.

No, you will not lose power.

ryansgts · Apr 16, 2020

Ok I gotcha. So as an example, I could put duel pumps in and 80lb injectors in right now, and that would be fine and I wouldn’t lose power? I’ll have to look up where I read that, I thought it was a reputable source but maybe it wasn’t [emoji2371]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

01yellercobra · Apr 16, 2020

ryansgts said:
Ok I gotcha. So as an example, I could put duel pumps in and 80lb injectors in right now, and that would be fine and I wouldn’t lose power? I’ll have to look up where I read that, I thought it was a reputable source but maybe it wasn’t [emoji2371]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Whoever said that has no idea what they're talking about. The only thing that'll happen is the fuel system won't be working as hard.

I ran that same set up on my big bore stroker while it was N/A. Never had an issue.

My post was for you planning on going turbo. Generally 60's top out about 600rwhp on E85. A buddy of mine cleared 800 with 80's on E85. But he had a big fuel system.

You need to decide on your goals now. It's easy to say you want 600-700hp. But the supporting parts between those two levels are $$$.

ryansgts · Apr 16, 2020

Ok good to know, thank you for the info!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

96blak54 · Apr 16, 2020

Fuel tuning E85 n/a is nothing like fuel tuning forced induced.

Tuners will yack about lamda lamda lamda but unless your tuner is experienced in n/a E85 tuning, you will waste alot of time money effort.

01yellercobra · Apr 16, 2020

And I don't know much about the 2V, but I believe the 300rwhp might be a little much to ask without extra parts. My opinion...drive 9t as is while you gather parts.

01yellercobra · Apr 16, 2020

96blak54 said:
Fuel tuning E85 n/a is nothing like fuel tuning forced induced.

Tuners will yack about lamda lamda lamda but unless your tuner is experienced in n/a E85 tuning, you will waste alot of time money effort.

What's the issue with tuning N/A?

ryansgts · Apr 16, 2020

I’ll have to verify with my tuner that he can do it, I just assumed he could, he’s extremely reputable in my area.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

white95 · Apr 16, 2020

ryansgts said:
I’ll have to verify with my tuner that he can do it, I just assumed he could, he’s extremely reputable in my area.

What shop/whom is it? Just curious.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ryansgts · Apr 16, 2020

Beyond redline in Green Bay Wisconsin

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

joe65 · Apr 16, 2020

96blak54 said:
Fuel tuning E85 n/a is nothing like fuel tuning forced induced.

Tuners will yack about lamda lamda lamda but unless your tuner is experienced in n/a E85 tuning, you will waste alot of time money effort.

yes, i think you'll just waste your time running e85 on a non boosted motor. The idea is the octane is over 100 so you can advance timing, but it just won't do much on the NA motor. Before my current money pit, i sold a turbo audi. I was running it on e85 and i had a switchable tune so i could run the e85 then switch back to 91 octane between tanks if wanted. Anyways, i just started running e85 after going to a bit bigger injector and no other fuel system mods. I didn't upsize my turbo (just intake and exhaust) and gained right around 100hp running the e85. I got addicted also, the way the car reacted to the increased on E boost was a lot of fun. I think it was peaking at 22lbs of boost and it was a not so big turbo.

ryansgts · Apr 16, 2020

joe65 said:
yes, i think you'll just waste your time running e85 on a non boosted motor. The idea is the octane is over 100 so you can advance timing, but it just won't do much on the NA motor. Before my current money pit, i sold a turbo audi. I was running it on e85 and i had a switchable tune so i could run the e85 then switch back to 91 octane between tanks if wanted. Anyways, i just started running e85 after going to a bit bigger injector and no other fuel system mods. I didn't upsize my turbo (just intake and exhaust) and gained right around 100hp running the e85. I got addicted also, the way the car reacted to the increased on E boost was a lot of fun. I think it was peaking at 22lbs of boost and it was a not so big turbo.

I know it’s probably not worth it alone, but I’m going turbo next summer so e85 with no boost is temporary. I know I’ll get some hp gains out of it now but I’m really just getting ready for turbo by doing it now.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

01yellercobra · Apr 16, 2020

Another thing to consider is if you're going to run it only on E85 after the turbo goes on you can really bump up the compression. I know a guy that built a big bore stroker at 12:1 with worked over 3v heads. He originally built it to be N/A, but threw a GT500 blower on it for fun. He made around 700rwhp at like 12 or 13psi.

Something to consider.

ryansgts · Apr 16, 2020

01yellercobra said:
Another thing to consider is if you're going to run it only on E85 after the turbo goes on you can really bump up the compression. I know a guy that built a big bore stroker at 12:1 with worked over 3v heads. He originally built it to be N/A, but threw a GT500 blower on it for fun. He made around 700rwhp at like 12 or 13psi.

Something to consider.

That’s crazy! I’m eyeing up a stroker kit right now and was gonna get pistons that kept compression around 9.5:1. I’ll have to look into that before ordering.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

evilcw311 · Apr 16, 2020

Might as well look towards 10-11:1 compression. That way it still has some ass end until turbo and it will help you keep a better power curve without noticing as much lag when you go turbo.

The old school way of thinking was that you had to build low comp when going with boost. Today technology has come so far and it’s nothing to boost a high comp motor, especially if your planning on e85.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk