Is the 302 even worth building anymore

bennylava · Sep 24, 2025

It's so outclassed by the modern engines that to me, the 302 is starting to look like a frail old antique. Even a stroked high hp 351 has "cap walk" problems according to the guys on the 460Ford forums. Unless you go with those aftermarket blocks, but that kind of speaks to my original question. If I can't build MY 302 and have a chance at beating modern cars, then why not just do a Godzilla conversion?

I know conversions are a whole big deal, and maybe that's why people still build up a 302. But you're kinda limited to power levels that modern cars start at. The 302 has been known to split open at 425-450 hp. For safety's sake, I think about 410 hp is all I would go for. I don't want to build an engine that dies 10,000 miles later. Or even less. I want it to last at least 75k miles, cause then I'd feel like I got my money's worth.

So does that mean I have to do a godzilla or coyote if I want reliability and high power? You would spend a lot of money to build a 302 way up. So why wouldn't you just put that money towards a conversion to an engine that can handle a lot more power?

At those prices, maybe just spend the extra $5k and have something that will beat just about anything.

96blak54 · Sep 24, 2025

Your thinking is not wrong! I feel the coyote is still hands down the better swap solution if you can make it fit. Almost 500hp and great fuel economy! Then if you want mo-powa, force induce it! Honestly though, the old foxbody platform has to be built accordingly to withstand them power levels and speed in excess of 150mph like the new mustangs can. The money begins to flow just to be competitive with anything new. In example, my 2001 Cobra compared to my 2012 mazdaspeed3 hatchback. The mazda will run circles around that cobra all day long and handles like a indy cart. Its 11 years newer technology, direct injection, variable cam timing, active this and that and so on. I surrender the cobra to what it is and just enjoy it. If i had to build it for competitive power, i would be considering a coyote or godzilla. Heck, have you seen what the naturally aspirated 3.7l Ford v6 can do turbo charged? Not even opening up the engine, they be pulling 800rwhp and its lightweight and they plentiful!

A godzilla sitting down in a foxbody does look good tho

weendoggy · Sep 24, 2025

I have both styles. 302 based (347 Boss Big Bore) and Gen I Coyote. The 347 is in my Cobra (replica) and the Coyote in the '02 Mustang. Both are fun, both are different. The 347 will just teach you a lesson in the Cobra if you're not careful. Plus, it looks good in there and period correct, even with EFI. The Coyote was just a swap, more or less, and fits nicely in the Mustang, given it already had the 4.6, but that was gutless. The power difference is better and I could use a bit more. That being said, it still wasn't just a "swap". There are additional costs surrounding all of this no matter how you look at it.

The Coyote is very smooth and nice to drive, street or track, so I can't complain. The 347 is the same, just a bit more on the "rough" side. I guess it just depends on what you're final goal is.

Snorky · Sep 24, 2025

Honestly in the end it will probably be a wash on the cost. I was talking to a guy that had a built modular 2v turbo and parted it out to go built LS turbo. In the end he said it was maybe a thousand or so different. Netted similarly results.. A drop in the bucket of a project that size. Say you swap a coyote and you luck out at 12k in the swap. That's probably with a t45 or tr3650 stock. That's a lot of money to build a 351.

Comes down to what you want out of it. Do you want it to feel like an old, snappy period correct engine that makes music, or do you want a smooth operating coyote race car that makes horrid noises.

Snorky · Sep 24, 2025

Think about it outside of racing and keeping up with the Joneses. As soon as you're at the end of your project, whatever it is. Some guy will line up next to you and you'll get waxed by the latest and greatest. Think about the engines personality, how it drives. Sound. Power delivery. Ease and cost of maintaining. Unless it's a dedicated race car, your racing will make up very little of the driving experience.

gatorblue92 · Sep 24, 2025

Snorky said:
Honestly in the end it will probably be a wash on the cost. I was talking to a guy that had a built modular 2v turbo and parted it out to go built LS turbo. In the end he said it was maybe a thousand or so different. Netted similarly results.. A drop in the bucket of a project that size. Say you swap a coyote and you luck out at 12k in the swap. That's probably with a t45 or tr3650 stock. That's a lot of money to build a 351.

Comes down to what you want out of it. Do you want it to feel like an old, snappy period correct engine that makes music, or do you want a smooth operating coyote race car that makes horrid noises.

I'm a huge fan of an old snappy period correct engine which makes music.

96blak54 · Sep 24, 2025

I deleted the cats and mufflers on my cobra. Flowing through an Xpipe out the factory tails.....or should i say trumpets. The modular engine is ear gasm beyond 6k rpm! Fast or not, i surrender and simply enjoy the car

duh09 · Sep 24, 2025

If you think it takes a Coyote or Godzilla to get modern car performance, just go buy a modern car. 1st Gen Coyote cars are under $10k now-a-days- you're going to have a very hard time swapping a 5.0L SN95 for under that unless you are fully capable of doing all the work yourself and can really luck up on some of the swap bits. I had picked up a dirt cheap Coyote for my Mystic, which would have been an easier swap since it was already modular, and promptly pulled out when I realized I would probably be another $8k in getting front end accessories, exhaust, and all the misc swap bits. I don't know what used Godzilla's go for but they haven't been out super long, so I imagine they haven't got cheap yet either. I know you can buy a crate Godzilla with a trans and ECM combo straight from Ford for a swap for around the $20k mark - that's deep into S550 territory, and touching into 3rd gen Coyote money if you factor in the cost of the SN95 and the swap parts to finish it out.

302s splitting can pretty much be ruled into just a couple categories - shitty balance on the bottom end and shitty tuning and shitty luck. ECUs are lightyears better now-a-days than what they were building in 1995, slapping chips on computers developed in the 80s, tuning knowledge is further than where we were then. I can almost guarantee half the 302s running around need a harmonic balancer on them unless they're running a good aftermarket performance unit. The rubber in the OEs fails after this long and the new replacement ones are not great, the rubber seems to last about 5-10 years in them. You take a motor with a not well balanced bottom end, slap a ton of tuning on it, and rev it way past where it should be and split it goes. Shitty luck can strike any build.

There's plenty of folks and plenty of threads of folks running well over 400whp on a stock block. Some ok-ish heads and boost will do it all day long. A tuner I followed that does a lot of turbo LS stuff, posted a Foxbody recently that he rolled 521whp through a Vortech/GT40 intake/ Edelbrock head combo. It had a pretty little aggressive torque curve once boost was rolling in, but if you were driving normally, it'd drive fine. Trickflow's newer 11R series heads with a good cam/intake combo and supporting mods are hitting 400whp on a full SBE, there's a ton of builds out there documenting that if you wanted to stay N/A. It doesn't take a crazy radical cam for it either, just a much more efficient head design and modern head geometry applied to a SBF head. I think I paid $2500ish for my used Vortech setup, $1500 on AFR enforcer heads, probably $1000ish in an overkill fuel setup because I'd like to go E85 in the future- I lucked up and already had a DSS bottom end and a believed blower cam in the car when I got it, but I'm also hoping to be much closer to that 500whp range. The Vortech/heads would get to right on the doorstep of 400whp, supporting mods would get you over it.

Anyways, SBF>

I_LIKE_TURTLEZ · Sep 24, 2025

RAU03MACH · Sep 24, 2025

5.0 is a good but i am going to swap it with a 5.8 as soon as possible
id like to run the crap out of it before i die or get to dam old
a couple good reasons gas milage still not bad
good cruzin engine
and if you bought it stock good classic car with a classic 5.0 is cool
really up to you

Snorky · Sep 25, 2025

96blak54 said:
I deleted the cats and mufflers on my cobra. Flowing through an Xpipe out the factory tails.....or should i say trumpets. The modular engine is ear gasm beyond 6k rpm! Fast or not, i surrender and simply enjoy the car

The modular 2v and 4v both just for the best sounding late model mustang exhaust with the 302 sbf.

I_LIKE_TURTLEZ · Sep 25, 2025

Snorky said:
The modular 2v and 4v both just for the best sounding late model mustang exhaust with the 302 sbf.

People roll their windows down just to hear my 4v coupled with x-pipe chambered 40's, the other day some random guy behind me was filming my exhaust as I rowed the gears from a light.

When I see a Coyote I make sure my windows are rolled up, they sound like farting butt trumpets thanks to the firing order.

RAU03MACH · Sep 25, 2025

Not mine just at idle in line at any burger joint
and the people at the order speaker can't hear what's being said
i had one person telling me to shut my car off so he could take the order
mine is just that deep tone that sets car alarms off

07GtS197 · Sep 25, 2025

I agree with everyone else but the thing is what is op using the car for. If it’s a daily it’ll last a long time even if it’s making 400 hp. Aftermarket top end with a nice cam and you’ll be close to those numbers at the crank.

94IndyPace · Sep 25, 2025

Bet I’m 12k deep in my blown 347 build and that’s me doing everything except the block machine work. Granted it is a Dart block that wasn’t cheap. Big numbers equal stupid money. But I’m also way over those coyote hp numbers. All depends on what you want out of the car

white95 · Sep 26, 2025

I_LIKE_TURTLEZ said:
People roll their windows down just to hear my 4v coupled with x-pipe chambered 40's, the other day some random guy behind me was filming my exhaust as I rowed the gears from a light.

When I see a Coyote I make sure my windows are rolled up, they sound like farting butt trumpets thanks to the firing order.

Lol

Kinda sucks always being behind them..

bennylava · Sep 26, 2025

Snorky said:
Honestly in the end it will probably be a wash on the cost. I was talking to a guy that had a built modular 2v turbo and parted it out to go built LS turbo. In the end he said it was maybe a thousand or so different. Netted similarly results.. A drop in the bucket of a project that size. Say you swap a coyote and you luck out at 12k in the swap. That's probably with a t45 or tr3650 stock. That's a lot of money to build a 351.

Comes down to what you want out of it. Do you want it to feel like an old, snappy period correct engine that makes music, or do you want a smooth operating coyote race car that makes horrid noises.

Yeah that's what I was thinking, it would be a wash on the cost. To remain competitive with modern stuff you would probably need to be what.. 550 hp? Yeah that power would probably beat a coyote, but if of course you'll run into people who have done a few mods to their car. Now they're right back up there with ya. Someone said to be aware of "just enjoying the car", which I will do, but I also want to win some races.

And really, if you can afford to dump $12k into a car you have disposable income. I'm not all that concerned about price, within reason of course. But if it was $12k to build up my 302 properly, and $17k to buy a wrecked godzilla donor truck, I'm just going to buy the truck. Seems like all upside. There will be no concern of the block cracking at 550hp. Then there's the low rpm torque of a "big block" engine. I hear that the godzilla beats the Ford 460 in higher torque at even lower rpm.

As for the sound, I know some people really care about that. But to me it always seemed like there was an element of... attention seeking. Like they wanted the car to have a certain sound (and be much louder than factory) so more people would look at them. Not really my bag lol. The cars are fun that's true and I do like to look at them, but actively trying to get people to do it, and imagining them doing it isn't for me.

Snorky · Sep 26, 2025

bennylava said:
Yeah that's what I was thinking, it would be a wash on the cost. To remain competitive with modern stuff you would probably need to be what.. 550 hp? Yeah that power would probably beat a coyote, but if of course you'll run into people who have done a few mods to their car. Now they're right back up there with ya. Someone said to be aware of "just enjoying the car", which I will do, but I also want to win some races.

And really, if you can afford to dump $12k into a car you have disposable income. I'm not all that concerned about price, within reason of course. But if it was $12k to build up my 302 properly, and $17k to buy a wrecked godzilla donor truck, I'm just going to buy the truck. Seems like all upside. There will be no concern of the block cracking at 550hp. Then there's the low rpm torque of a "big block" engine. I hear that the godzilla beats the Ford 460 in higher torque at even lower rpm.

As for the sound, I know some people really care about that. But to me it always seemed like there was an element of... attention seeking. Like they wanted the car to have a certain sound (which is of course much louder than factory) so more people would look at them. Not really my bag lol. The cars are fun that's true and I do like to look at them, but actively trying to get people to do it, and imagining them doing it isn't for me.

Sounds to me like you really want a big block godzilla swap. If the difference between 10 and 20k isnt a big deal to you or affect your life, just get what you want. Just plan it out and spread sheet everything in advance and know it isn't an out and back in kind of thing. It could very well be an absolute pain in the ass. It sounds fun and rewarding at the end and during the process though.

On a brighter side of doing a godzilla out of wrecked truck is that the engine is oem, has been run and broken in before. The downside is it probably was a fleet truck with a mostly idle hours on it(can be see as good or bad) .

96blak54 · Sep 26, 2025

Circling back around to how engines sound. I agree the coyote sound is different from the newer mustangs and not favored, but Im sure its the exhaust setups and whats available for the platform, because i know of some coyote swapped foxbodys and sn95's that do not sound like the newer mustangs.

Ive been watching Brian Wolfe pioneer the Godzilla. He has pushed the factory stock engine to 1000 hp and with relative ease. Id say if you have the coin and that damn hotroders itch to build something,....move forward with the godzilla.