New brakes squishy after several bleeds

[Snahsberries]

I just put new calipers, rotors, and pads on the front, bled all four, and I have done that 3 times and the master cylinder twice. Last time I did, the pedal felt pretty good, I woke up this morning, and it's back to feeling a little long and squishy. I can push it all the way to the floor with some effort. It doesn't feel dangerous to drive or anything, just doesn't feel "right" and it's bothering me. Any ideas? Faulty calipers or are hidden pockets of air surfacing after driving for a while?

 

[ttocs]

any chance you got air in the line after the master cylinder, before the abs pump? IF that is the case you will need to cycle the abs and then rebleed them. If you have the computer that can do this it is pretty easy if not another option is to take it to a dusty spot where you can get the brakes to lock up and when the abs kicks in, it should move the air through the pump. Then you can go bleed them again, I had to go this route myself but it worked.

 

[Snahsberries]

any chance you got air in the line after the master cylinder, before the abs pump? IF that is the case you will need to cycle the abs and then rebleed them. If you have the computer that can do this it is pretty easy if not another option is to take it to a dusty spot where you can get the brakes to lock up and when the abs kicks in, it should move the air through the pump. Then you can go bleed them again, I had to go this route myself but it worked.

I didn't let the cylinder run dry, but based on how much air was coming out of it, I wouldn't be surprised. I'm just not sure why it felt fine for most of a day then went back to squishy after that.

 

[lwarrior1016]

I didn't let the cylinder run dry, but based on how much air was coming out of it, I wouldn't be surprised. I'm just not sure why it felt fine for most of a day then went back to squishy after that.

Check all of your connections for leaks also. The smallest leak will let air in the system

 

[cobrajeff96]

If brakes were as they should just after the bleed but several hours later they are not is a pretty strong indicator of a leak. Check beneath car, and beneath major components/connection points. If there's no indication of a leak, it could be the m/c. Usually ABS isn't even a factor as with the car off the solenoids are wide open. What year/model is the car and did you install any big brake calipers?

 

[Snahsberries]

2002 Mustang GT convertible. And, they are remanufactured stock parts I put on them. The breaks felt okay in the pedal before the install, I'm gonna get it up on the ramps asap and check where the lines meet the calipers. Maybe the guy I did the bleed with didn't tighten the bleed screws back up completely or something either. Should I apply grease to where the break lines meet the calipers? Could that help with air getting sucked in?

 

[cobrajeff96]

No, do not grease those.

But make sure you have a copper crush washer on both sides of the brake line, one underneath the head of the banjo bolt and one underneath where the line block meets the caliper. Torque it to 35 ft lb.

 

[Snahsberries]

I think that is exactly what is wrong. I'm going to tell him we gotta jack it up and fix that. I appreciate it. I'll keep y'all posted. Thank you for being friendly despite some probably not so smart questions.

 

[cobrajeff96]

Hey no prob

 

[lwarrior1016]

I think that is exactly what is wrong. I'm going to tell him we gotta jack it up and fix that. I appreciate it. I'll keep y'all posted. Thank you for being friendly despite some probably not so smart questions.

We don’t classify any question as a “not so smart” question.

The forum is here to help. Everyone here will do their best to throw in an idea and most of the time, collectively, we can figure it out. We hope you stick around.

 

[96blak54]

I went through a brake blead scenario with these mustangs that was a strong educational experience. The rear driver caliper was swapped and during the bleed process for just that caliper, the fluid reservoir emptied out with just a few pumps(a helping hand in the driver seat pressing on the brake pedal) causing air to get into the system. With the car on all four jackstands, wheels off, i had to make rounds to each caliper bleeding them and making 100% sure the reservoir was topped off after each pump. I think i circled the car 20 times, bleeding each brake 1 pump at a time. Not fun at all but brought the system back and with clean fluids.

 

[TTSaleen]

I've been using this to help with my brake fluid replacements and keep air out.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CJ5DZE2/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

or

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00OM751EC/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[Mustang5L5]

I've had to do an ABS cycle on my car to get the last bit of air out. Tried it 3-4 times the standard way even bleeding the MC and the pedal just felt too soft.

Hooked up ForScan, ran the ABS bleed procedure (cycled each solenoid as you bleed one brake) and that did the trick.

 

[Snahsberries]

If it was the abs, would it be pretty obvious right away that there's still air in the system? I know for sure the crush washers were installed wonky by the person who did it, now I know what a crush washer is. I just thought it was for spacing, not for a seal. I think I'm missing a crush washer on each side, if my memory serves me.

 

[lwarrior1016]

If it was the abs, would it be pretty obvious right away that there's still air in the system? I know for sure the crush washers were installed wonky by the person who did it, now I know what a crush washer is. I just thought it was for spacing, not for a seal. I think I'm missing a crush washer on each side, if my memory serves me.

If that is the case, and you’re missing crush washers, fix it quickly and I wouldn’t drive it any more. That’s a good spot to leak and brake fluid will kill any paint or finish that it touches.

 

[Mustang5L5]

If you know for a fact two washers weren’t used on both sides of the brake line fitting where the banjo bolt connects to the caliper, I would get those on there ASAP before driving the car anymore

 

[Snahsberries]

Got it, guys. I'll get a ride to work in the morning. I really appreciate it.

 

[Snahsberries]

Does anyone happen to know what size those washers are? Google isn't being much of a help, and they don't sell them anywhere in Alaska according to O'Reilly's and AutoZone.

 

[cobrajeff96]

First, copper crush washers are cheap. You could just shotgun it and buy a variety of sizes, bearing in mind that you'll need 2 per caliper x how many calipers you think might be affected by all of this.

But usually (usually) they are sized standard across the auto industry at 3/8 inches or about 9.5mm (10mm let's say). And you probably can't go wrong there.

Bottom line up front: what you're after is the most snug fit of the crushs's inside diameter around the shank of the banjo bolt. That's really all that matters, although you also don't want the washer's outside diameter going past the head or flange of the bolt because the flat/machined caliper surface area for said bolt is usually just enough to accommodate the banjo bolt head/flange.

So take a banjo bolt to the hardware store and pick the right size accordingly. Can't go wrong with that approach. But you'll also want a couple more bottles of brake fluid in any case.

Once they're torque down, they can never be reused for a brake application again.

 

[Snahsberries]

Thank you! I wasn't sure if it could just be any copper washer that'll fit or if it has to say "crush washer" specifically because they're softer or something. I ended up ordering a box of like 9 different sizes yesterday, but if i can just go to a hardware store and buy a handful of regular ole' copper washers tomorrow, I'll do that instead. Thank you, again. This forum is awesome, and all of you are great, it's very appreciated.