Two styles of radios on the same Mustang

[MyLittlePony]

It really was a better format but sony killed it the exact same way they did betamax by saying only their media could be put on it so you were limited to what they produced

The downfall of the Sony Walkman. They were once THE name in portable music. When formats changed, they kept with the times. I had a discman. I also had a Walkman that could play TV airwaves. We were allowed to listen to music in class, so I essentially got to watch TV without the video.

Anyway, Sony absolutely would not make an MP3 player. They had their own record label, so in their minds, they would be promoting the piracy of their own music by having such a player. But people will still download music. Apple figured it out, and later did others that previously allowed free p2p file sharing. Rather than SELL legally owned digital music, AND a device to play it, they neglected an entire market until it was far too late. I don’t think anyone bought Sony’s MP3 player when it finally did come out. At least they won the HD DVD/Bluray format war.

 

[evilcw311]

The downfall of the Sony Walkman. They were once THE name in portable music. When formats changed, they kept with the times. I had a discman. I also had a Walkman that could play TV airwaves. We were allowed to listen to music in class, so I essentially got to watch TV without the video.

Anyway, Sony absolutely would not make an MP3 player. They had their own record label, so in their minds, they would be promoting the piracy of their own music by having such a player. But people will still download music. Apple figured it out, and later did others that previously allowed free p2p file sharing. Rather than SELL legally owned digital music, AND a device to play it, they neglected an entire market until it was far too late. I don’t think anyone bought Sony’s MP3 player when it finally did come out. At least they won the HD DVD/Bluray format war.

MP3’s are garbage anyways. It ruins the music.


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[ttocs]

MP3’s are garbage anyways. It ruins the music.


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no worse than sirius, or the average radio station I mean sure it lacks the warmth of records but what ever cds are better, but gone...

 

[evilcw311]

no worse than sirius, or the average radio station I mean sure it lacks the warmth of records but what ever cds are better, but gone...

Cd’s weren’t mp3 unless you burnt a mp3 loaded disc. CDs were recorded at roughly 1200-1400kb as opposed to 230-330kb


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[MyLittlePony]

MP3’s are garbage anyways. It ruins the music.

ok boomer. Tell me all about how warm and pure analog vinyl and cassettes are.

 

[apsmith49921]

ok boomer. Tell me all about how warm and pure analog vinyl and cassettes are.

High quality recordings have their place. Depends on what you are listening to. Sometimes the vinyl produces the original sound much better.

Now Its my personal belief all live music sucks compared to the studio version lol

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[evilcw311]

ok boomer. Tell me all about how warm and pure analog vinyl and cassettes are.

Seeing as you only a few years younger then me then you should watch using that boomer comment.

Vinyl on a nicely built hifi system is very clean and warm and as original as music you’ll find today was ever recorded.

Cassettes were and still are garbage. It was a poor attempt to minimize reals and make them mobile and they failed horribly.

Cd’s are as clean of a digital sound as you’d find but still lacks the warmth of a record.

Streaming is convenient and has its place but in a discussion about quality audio it has no place. Keep in mind I sell and build very high end audio video systems for a living. You truly haven’t heard music in it’s original state until you’ve heard it on a true hifi system.

Appreciating great sound doesn’t make one old, it makes them sophisticated.


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[ttocs]

still not a record fan.

 

[evilcw311]

still not a record fan.

When’s the last time you heard vinyl on a quality hifi system??

I’m not talking a bunch of garbage bought at Best Buy or online.


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[ttocs]

you seem to have forgot ten I spent 10 yrs installing in scottsdale. They have some nice stereo stores there but they are by appointment only and certainly not a big box. Still not a fan of a medium that degrades every time its played and I can't convince myself that I feel warmer by that loss.

 

[evilcw311]

you seem to have forgot ten I spent 10 yrs installing in scottsdale. They have some nice stereo stores there but they are by appointment only and certainly not a big box. Still not a fan of a medium that degrades every time its played and I can't convince myself that I feel warmer by that loss.

Vinyl doesn’t degrade each time it’s played. Maybe if you played the same record over and over all day but with normal use records last. That’s why you can find so much vintage vinyl that still sounds great.

It’s all in how you take care of it.

As far as the stores in Scottsdale goes, how many did you go into and they demoed a truly high end system?? Hifi systems range anywhere from entry level at $5,000 and range to well over $1M!!!


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[ttocs]

Before I even got to scottsdale the last store I worked at was mainly onkyo and kenwoods high end line with definitive tech but I know you will say those are crap. Maybe your not aware snottsdale is the uber rich side of phoenix? The first shop I worked at (Streamline audio) built alma gates original bronco, was next door to the barret jackson home office and there were 3 nice/small shop but VERY high end home audio shops with in eyeshot that the owners were all friends with. They did the home audio for the car stereo shop owner and we did all the installs in their cars. Maybe I didn't go to enough of shops to know a what sounds good? I have heard during a real blind A/B testing of the same albums/media to sway me done by one of those owners. Now I know that he was wrong as well because ANYONE that questions why a cd can't sound as good as a record gets looked at like that crazy vegan looks at you when you say that you like the taste of a steak. So let me ask you why can't a cd sound as good now as a 30 yr old record that has been played 23 billion times but still sounds exactly the same as the day it was pressed?

 

[evilcw311]

Before I even got to scottsdale the last store I worked at was mainly onkyo and kenwoods high end line with definitive tech but I know you will say those are crap. Maybe your not aware snottsdale is the uber rich side of phoenix? The first shop I worked at (Streamline audio) built alma gates original bronco, was next door to the barret jackson home office and there were 3 nice/small shop but VERY high end home audio shops with in eyeshot that the owners were all friends with. They did the home audio for the car stereo shop owner and we did all the installs in their cars. Maybe I didn't go to enough of shops to know a what sounds good? I have heard during a real blind A/B testing of the same albums/media to sway me done by one of those owners. Now I know that he was wrong as well because ANYONE that questions why a cd can't sound as good as a record gets looked at like that crazy vegan looks at you when you say that you like the taste of a steak. So let me ask you why can't a cd sound as good now as a 30 yr old record that has been played 23 billion times but still sounds exactly the same as the day it was pressed?

Scott I know you know car stereo but the second you said “high end” and “Onkyo and Kenwood” in the same sentence you showed that you know nothing at all about high end audio aka HiFi. They make products hat are mass produced for the masses and have nothing at all that is even remotely close to high end. They’re built to run in houses where they’ll be pushed and abused for hours on end but not necessarily produce truly quality audio. That’s not to say they’re not great products. I currently have one of Onkyo’s most high end 7.2 home theater receivers that o used in my old man cave for years. I’ve had plenty of kenwood car stereo products over the years. They’re great reliable products.

But they’re not HiFi. They’re not high end quality audio and no respectable and knowledgeable high end AV shop carries that stuff.

Krell, McIntosh, Acurus, Aragon, Arcam, Roksan, Pro-Ject. That’s just a few names of companies who make amps and preamps. You’ll find none of these in chain stores. You won’t find them being sold legally online. The cheapest you’ll find any of these products start at thousands and thousands and you can’t just buy one piece and be done.

Totem Acoustics, Monitor Audio Platinum, Waterfall Audio, Göebel, Manger, Piega, Volti. These are companies who make speakers ranging from $18k a pair to well over $250k per tower.

All of this is hand built in Germany, England, and a couple other places nowhere near China.

If you’d like to learn about true high end audio let me know.


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[ttocs]

Scott I know you know car stereo but the second you said “high end” and “Onkyo and Kenwood” in the same sentence you showed that you know nothing at all about high end audio aka HiFi. They make products hat are mass produced for the masses and have nothing at all that is even remotely close to high end. They’re built to run in houses where they’ll be pushed and abused for hours on end but not necessarily produce truly quality audio. That’s not to say they’re not great products. I currently have one of Onkyo’s most high end 7.2 home theater receivers that o used in my old man cave for years. I’ve had plenty of kenwood car stereo products over the years. They’re great reliable products.

But they’re not HiFi. They’re not high end quality audio and no respectable and knowledgeable high end AV shop carries that stuff.

Krell, McIntosh, Acurus, Aragon, Arcam, Roksan, Pro-Ject. That’s just a few names of companies who make amps and preamps. You’ll find none of these in chain stores. You won’t find them being sold legally online. The cheapest you’ll find any of these products start at thousands and thousands and you can’t just buy one piece and be done.

Totem Acoustics, Monitor Audio Platinum, Waterfall Audio, Göebel, Manger, Piega, Volti. These are companies who make speakers ranging from $18k a pair to well over $250k per tower.

All of this is hand built in Germany, England, and a couple other places nowhere near China.

If you’d like to learn about true high end audio let me know.


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Ok, first off stop talking down to me like I don't know what I am talking about dickhead. We both started in big boxes so don't act like your looking down on me. I said the store I started at that store and that was their high end and I want to point out that while I know nothing about high end because I used "onkyo and high end in the same sentence" that it would mean you do not know it either, since you said it as well..... I mean you know your shit 10x more than me from what I gather and what are ya running?! What you analog beaters fail to remember is that SOUND IS FUCKING SUBJECTIVE. You telling me what sounds good or better and that what I am saying I thing sounds bad is like telling me what pizza is the best. State your opinion and it doesn't matter. Those stores in scottsdale had all those brands, all tube driven, crystal isolators on the floor with cryogenically frozen wires but yea I don't know what I like. You record assholes are just like those vegan assholes we all hate that have to tell us why we are wrong. And beside that I thought we were talking record/digital comparison so don't change the subj.

 

[evilcw311]

Ok, first off stop talking down to me like I don't know what I am talking about dickhead. We both started in big boxes so don't act like your looking down on me. I said the store I started at that store and that was their high end and I want to point out that while I know nothing about high end because I used "onkyo and high end in the same sentence" that it would mean you do not know it either, since you said it as well..... I mean you know your shit 10x more than me from what I gather and what are ya running?! What you analog beaters fail to remember is that SOUND IS FUCKING SUBJECTIVE. You telling me what sounds good or better and that what I am saying I thing sounds bad is like telling me what pizza is the best. State your opinion and it doesn't matter. Those stores in scottsdale had all those brands, all tube driven, crystal isolators on the floor with cryogenically frozen wires but yea I don't know what I like. You record assholes are just like those vegan assholes we all hate that have to tell us why we are wrong. And beside that I thought we were talking record/digital comparison so don't change the subj.

Let’s clear something up since your obvious out of your mind tonight. I never said anything about having Onkyo in use for hifi. I had it in use for a media room that was for movies. I also bought it when I didn’t own my business yet and didn’t have access to the direct dealer lines I do now.

That’s my hifi system that I just sold to one of my customers cause I’m building a newer custom setup. Those are Totem Winds($18k msrp) with a Krell Digital Vanguard($15k msrp), Arcam CDS27($2.3k msrp), Rega Planar6 turntable($2.3k msrp) to play those horribly awful sounding records, Arcam cartridge driver and preamp for the Rega($1.2k msrp).

Nobody talked down to you but until you can actually have a realistic discussion about hifi where you actually show some kind of knowledge then it’s pretty self explanatory.

And I didn’t actually start in a big box store. I just happened to work at one in my line of jobs. I started in a custom Av shop when I was in high school. I don’t give 2 shits about some shops in Arizona. It doesn’t matter how many rich people live there. I do business in many cities where tons of millionaires live and billionaires because there’s not always a true high end professional hifi shop. You think Tampa doesn’t have shops like that??? They do but even most of them don’t carry the seriously high end hifi stuff. That’s how I have gotten the customers that I have down there.

Ive never said o don’t use cd’s. I own around a thousand of them. They have a purpose. I never said I don’t stream. It has its purpose. I choose to use vinyl because of what it is and how it sounds. Sound is subjective. It is different to every person. But at the same time if someone hasn’t been exposed to a true hifi experience then they don’t know the difference.

It’s like people who say driving a corvette is comparable to driving a Ferrari. It’s obvious they’ve never driven the latter.


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[ttocs]

you have told me more than a few times that I don't know what I am talking about, that I am out of my mind. All this started because I said "I still don't like the sound of records". I didn't say "Your a freaking nutcase and have no idea what your talking about". Then you took this into the whole "You don't know what your talking about saying onkyo is high end... I have a high end onkyo".

I will end this debate the same way I started it and continued. I do not like sound of records. I am not sure why or how you can judge that I have not been around enough "hifi" systems or they just have not been demostrated to me correctly to make me a believer but I have seen PLENTY of systems sprinkled with the snake oil that allows you to sell that gear at those prices but to be honest I was expecting more. The shit I saw was crystal isolators, crynogenically frozen wire and you could not believe the warmth it added to the imaging and how much deeper and alive the soundstage became or some crap like that. I know they go WAY more expensive than what you were trying to impress me with and there are audio snobs that would look down on you the same way you are me because you didn't drop 100k on on it. AGain, sound is subjective. We are not arguing why my car is so much faster than your because if that were the case its something that is easy to prove today. You are trying to tell me what sounds good and why and its just because you think I have never seen the happy glow of a tube and still heard that ever so slight "warmth"/distortion that is present on the best of turntables?

 

[evilcw311]

you have told me more than a few times that I don't know what I am talking about, that I am out of my mind. All this started because I said "I still don't like the sound of records". I didn't say "Your a freaking nutcase and have no idea what your talking about". Then you took this into the whole "You don't know what your talking about saying onkyo is high end... I have a high end onkyo".

I will end this debate the same way I started it and continued. I do not like sound of records. I am not sure why or how you can judge that I have not been around enough "hifi" systems or they just have not been demostrated to me correctly to make me a believer but I have seen PLENTY of systems sprinkled with the snake oil that allows you to sell that gear at those prices but to be honest I was expecting more. The shit I saw was crystal isolators, crynogenically frozen wire and you could not believe the warmth it added to the imaging and how much deeper and alive the soundstage became or some crap like that. I know they go WAY more expensive than what you were trying to impress me with and there are audio snobs that would look down on you the same way you are me because you didn't drop 100k on on it. AGain, sound is subjective. We are not arguing why my car is so much faster than your because if that were the case its something that is easy to prove today. You are trying to tell me what sounds good and why and its just because you think I have never seen the happy glow of a tube and still heard that ever so slight "warmth"/distortion that is present on the best of turntables?

Your either off your meds, not wearing your glasses, or just simply can’t read what’s written in front of your face. I never said Onkyo or kenwood was high end or hifi. I said that their NOT HIGH END OR HIFI!!!! Learn to read. It’s still there in front of your face. I said they make great reliable products I said that I’ve owned both in the past. I never said they were any part of any high end system I owned.

Is there people who’d look down on the system I recently sold?? Sure!! Just because I own a business doing this doesn’t mean I can afford to personally own some of the systems that I install.

There’s an example. It’s one of my customers setups that they paid over $500k for. That total setup with preamps, Tube amps and all is McIntosh. I love his system but it’s out of my personal price range. I did enjoy it in my home for 4 weeks during break in period but I can’t afford that stuff to keep at this point in my life. But it far exceeded my previous system(which I got all parts at less than dealer pricing for demo purposes) I don’t try to impress anyone with anything I own. I try to show them the difference.

Go back to being grumpy about anything else’s. This thread will soon be cleaned up as it’s gotten far off and away from the op’s post.


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[ttocs]

records suck

 

[evilcw311]

records suck

So does grumpy people and crazies but here we all are.

It’s nice outside today. Go drive that beast and get some mileage on it!!!!


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[MyLittlePony]

I associate Onkyo with cheap and Kenwood with expensive. That doesn’t necessarily mean either one is worse or superior than the other.

Vinyl is about the experience more than the music itself. It’s the sound/noise you’re after. All the pops and static. It’s like listening to old time radio shows and music from the 30s on a vacuum tube console radio. It’s a listening experience. You can play modern 21st century digital music using the “phono” auxiliary input, but it would just sounds weird. It’s like how people like going to live concerts. The music is better. Record live music though, and it sucks.