Sooo, you think I'll be fine with a sway bar, MM lowers and replace the upper bushings?
MM Torque Arm and PHB Questions
- Thread starter CCobraW
- Start date
Stock sway bar, poly bushings in the front hangers, shortened 3/8" links that go to the control arms. Stock sway bar on the rear, J&M lowers, poly inserts on the uppers, and NEW uppers from ford racing. If you car has north of 75k on it, new upper control arms all the way. Larger than stock sway bars will cause a push to develop. A decent spring and shock combo will do wonders in combination. It all depends on how aggressive you want to be. But this is steven's secret suspension recipe. It'll knock your socks off for a street car.
I've got more than 200k 
It's ridiculous trying to find a stock sway bar, remember, the V6's didn't come with one.
I'm becoming an MM fan boy, so I think I still might use their lowers on the rear end. I already have poly up front, and an eibach front sway. investing in the K and coilovers up front this year eventually.
Om nom nom
It's ridiculous trying to find a stock sway bar, remember, the V6's didn't come with one.
I'm becoming an MM fan boy, so I think I still might use their lowers on the rear end. I already have poly up front, and an eibach front sway. investing in the K and coilovers up front this year eventually.
Om nom nom
Mustanger
Well-Known Member
I have the full Eibach Prokit Plus...front & rear sway bars, Eibach shocks & struts & springs, MM lower control arms, MM full length subframes, I love the way my car handles & responds but I am NOT an expert by any means...I wonder what a good driver would say about it & what I could improve next. I plan on going with Koni Yellow adjustables soon I have quite a few miles on the Eibachs & want to try the Konis ...I have contacted Whiteline about a Watts link for my 94...they say be patient a bit... Both the subframes & LCA's are incredible mods as far as I am concerned...I love being planted going around corners under hard throttle & the solid feel...
I have a lot of fun on open curves where I can see ahead & do hit them hard as I dare on dry roads only...corner carving is great fun & I guess my motorcycle days are still in me! But now in a Mustang. I know my rear end moves too much under the cornering & want to eliminate it. On well known roads & curves I can easily & safely IMO double the speed of the warning signs...actually much higher but I don't do that anymore.
We have one freeway onramp that is 358* I think, nicely banked & if no one is in front ...Oooooh Boy!
I have a lot of fun on open curves where I can see ahead & do hit them hard as I dare on dry roads only...corner carving is great fun & I guess my motorcycle days are still in me! But now in a Mustang. I know my rear end moves too much under the cornering & want to eliminate it. On well known roads & curves I can easily & safely IMO double the speed of the warning signs...actually much higher but I don't do that anymore.
We have one freeway onramp that is 358* I think, nicely banked & if no one is in front ...Oooooh Boy!
Slykin
Well-Known Member
If anything get a bigger rear swaybar. That'll help get rid of some understeer.
I run a GT bar out front and a Cobra bar out back. It's balanced pretty well for the most part, but once I installed the PHB some tracks don't like a rear bar, which is odd. But I'm still learning this setup.
If you want to feel where your car needs suspension help, get some r-comp tires, and get out on a road course. That will tell you real quick which part of the car is loose.
If you want to feel where your car needs suspension help, get some r-comp tires, and get out on a road course. That will tell you real quick which part of the car is loose.
Magic
Well-Known Member
Griggs Racing and FAYS2.
Cant run tailpipes with the Griggs W/L.
There is also Cortex Racing, but Ive heard they have a lawsuit against them by Griggs for compying a design or two. Owner of Cortex was a former Griggs employee.
Magic
Well-Known Member
I'll share my experiences here.
Focusing on handling and street. I dont care much about drag racing anymore.
I've had both setups on my cars. My old car (the old Vibrant Red) received the complete GR40 Super Street Kit, but before that it had the Eibach ProStreet coilovers kit and sway bars. My new car, I decided to go with an IRS.
However, the 4 link will be absolutely fine for the majority. For MY liking it sucks. Blame riding in and driving cars like Gen 2 Vipers and Corvettes and 3rd/4th gen Fbodies for that.
Again, this is MY opinion on having all 3 setups on a Mustang. Modified 4 link vs TA/PHB and now IRS.
Just a quick description on my 3 setups and components used:
Setup 1:
95 Vibrant Red Fobra
8.8 SRA
Eibach ProStreet CoilOvers= F: 200LB coil over spring over an Eibach Strut R: Stock location 250LB spring (Eibach Sportline rear springs are a 250lb spring as well) with Eibach shocks. These are the spring rates that come with the Eibach kit.
Eibach Sway Bars F and R
Prothane Short End links (for front swaybar)
MM FL Subframes
Strut Brace and MM K member brace along with Prothane A-arm bushings and C/C plates.
Lakewood 20150 LCAs
Stock UCAs
17x9 Cobra R reps, 255/40 up front and 275/40 in the rear.
Compared to Stock, BIG difference in handling and ride quality (not a jarring ride at all, as one would expect from a lowered mustang, BUT having a matched spring and damper combo is KEY).
Under agressive cornering situations you could feel the rear end would be on the verge of wanting to slide out from under you.
However, for the majority of us this setup (or something similar) would be just great and left there.
Setup 2:
95 Vibrant Red Fobra
Griggs Racing GR40 Super Street Kit, upgraded the control arms (to bodyside hiem joint style) and the rear shocks (from the Street valved shock to their Track 1 shock)
http://www.griggsracing.com/product_info.php?cPath=4332_4310_4347_1060&products_id=555
So Panhard, torque Arm etc etc (all the components described in that link)
Spring Rates= Front: 350 lb. Rear: 250LB
Using the Eibach Swaybars.
17x9 Cobra R reps, 255/40 up front and 275/40 in the rear.
Compared to setup 1, what a difference in handling. It was like driving a completely different car, night and day). None of that feeling that the rear end wants to get out from under you. Street ride quality was the same as Setup 1. And the rear end felt positive going over bumpy roads etc.
Setup 3:
95 CW Cobra.
After a situation that happend at home in my garage, that involved some body damage to Vibrant Red that I didnt feel like spending the money to fix/bodywork and paint. I bought CW and proceeded part Vibrant Red out. I kept the 306 and T5 transmission and the front suspension pieces to install into CW. The rear GR40 Griggs suspension and SRA was sold off, along with the SRA from this CW Cobra.
I picked up an 03 IRS for a wicked deal and used the money saved (from paying the going rates of 03-04 IRS setups $1,000+) and bought the FTBR FT5000 Bushing kit.
Front =
GR40 C/C plates, Koni Yellows Single Adjustable struts, 350lb CO spring, Eibach Sway Bar, FRPP STB, MM 4point K-member brace, Prothane A-arm bushings, Short swaybar links, 03 Cobra steering rack and MM steering shaft.
Rear=
03 IRS, FTBR bushing Kit, Koni Yellow SA shocks, 550lb coilover springs, Eibach Swaybar, MM adjustable endlinks, billet flow IRS brace.
17x9 Cobra R reps, 255/40 up front
17x10.5 Cobra R reps, 285/40 out rear.
Street ride quality with the IRS, better than both the SRA setups. Agressive handling , this IRS setup is comparable to Setup 2 (TA and PHB).
Conclusion:
I cant decide an overall winner between IRS and an SRA with a TA and PHB, as there are Pros and Cons between each (read MMs link when they discuss the IRS vs SRA with TA and PHB and the points they give). So I'll give them a TIE.
Focusing on handling and street. I dont care much about drag racing anymore.
I've had both setups on my cars. My old car (the old Vibrant Red) received the complete GR40 Super Street Kit, but before that it had the Eibach ProStreet coilovers kit and sway bars. My new car, I decided to go with an IRS.
However, the 4 link will be absolutely fine for the majority. For MY liking it sucks. Blame riding in and driving cars like Gen 2 Vipers and Corvettes and 3rd/4th gen Fbodies for that.
Again, this is MY opinion on having all 3 setups on a Mustang. Modified 4 link vs TA/PHB and now IRS.
Just a quick description on my 3 setups and components used:
Setup 1:
95 Vibrant Red Fobra
8.8 SRA
Eibach ProStreet CoilOvers= F: 200LB coil over spring over an Eibach Strut R: Stock location 250LB spring (Eibach Sportline rear springs are a 250lb spring as well) with Eibach shocks. These are the spring rates that come with the Eibach kit.
Eibach Sway Bars F and R
Prothane Short End links (for front swaybar)
MM FL Subframes
Strut Brace and MM K member brace along with Prothane A-arm bushings and C/C plates.
Lakewood 20150 LCAs
Stock UCAs
17x9 Cobra R reps, 255/40 up front and 275/40 in the rear.
Compared to Stock, BIG difference in handling and ride quality (not a jarring ride at all, as one would expect from a lowered mustang, BUT having a matched spring and damper combo is KEY).
Under agressive cornering situations you could feel the rear end would be on the verge of wanting to slide out from under you.
However, for the majority of us this setup (or something similar) would be just great and left there.
Setup 2:
95 Vibrant Red Fobra
Griggs Racing GR40 Super Street Kit, upgraded the control arms (to bodyside hiem joint style) and the rear shocks (from the Street valved shock to their Track 1 shock)
http://www.griggsracing.com/product_info.php?cPath=4332_4310_4347_1060&products_id=555
So Panhard, torque Arm etc etc (all the components described in that link)
Spring Rates= Front: 350 lb. Rear: 250LB
Using the Eibach Swaybars.
17x9 Cobra R reps, 255/40 up front and 275/40 in the rear.
Compared to setup 1, what a difference in handling. It was like driving a completely different car, night and day). None of that feeling that the rear end wants to get out from under you. Street ride quality was the same as Setup 1. And the rear end felt positive going over bumpy roads etc.
Setup 3:
95 CW Cobra.
After a situation that happend at home in my garage, that involved some body damage to Vibrant Red that I didnt feel like spending the money to fix/bodywork and paint. I bought CW and proceeded part Vibrant Red out. I kept the 306 and T5 transmission and the front suspension pieces to install into CW. The rear GR40 Griggs suspension and SRA was sold off, along with the SRA from this CW Cobra.
I picked up an 03 IRS for a wicked deal and used the money saved (from paying the going rates of 03-04 IRS setups $1,000+) and bought the FTBR FT5000 Bushing kit.
Front =
GR40 C/C plates, Koni Yellows Single Adjustable struts, 350lb CO spring, Eibach Sway Bar, FRPP STB, MM 4point K-member brace, Prothane A-arm bushings, Short swaybar links, 03 Cobra steering rack and MM steering shaft.
Rear=
03 IRS, FTBR bushing Kit, Koni Yellow SA shocks, 550lb coilover springs, Eibach Swaybar, MM adjustable endlinks, billet flow IRS brace.
17x9 Cobra R reps, 255/40 up front
17x10.5 Cobra R reps, 285/40 out rear.
Street ride quality with the IRS, better than both the SRA setups. Agressive handling , this IRS setup is comparable to Setup 2 (TA and PHB).
Conclusion:
I cant decide an overall winner between IRS and an SRA with a TA and PHB, as there are Pros and Cons between each (read MMs link when they discuss the IRS vs SRA with TA and PHB and the points they give). So I'll give them a TIE.
Great write up, Majic. Good detail on the different setups.
I'd have to agree with the IRS and SRA differences. Different track/drive charectersistic definitely dictates which works better. But IRS will definitely be more tame and comfy on any steet driven car.
I'd have to agree with the IRS and SRA differences. Different track/drive charectersistic definitely dictates which works better. But IRS will definitely be more tame and comfy on any steet driven car.
Magic
Well-Known Member
Thanks Rich!
Going back to the OPs original post, if you decide to go with the PHB and TA setup from MM (guarantee it will be like driving a totally different car), get one of their packages (torque arm, panhard and LCAs).
http://www.maximummotorsports.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_5_504
You will need the MM Full Length SFCs if you dont have them already.
Keep in mind that some exhaust mods will be required and certain tailpipes fit with their Panhard bar.
A PHB and TA setup requires a different spring rate (stiffer spring) in the rear, and use one their custom valved Bilstein HD struts/shocks packages.
Before you drop the $$ to buy:
Read this link thoroughly from MM about their Torque Arms and corresponding components.
http://www.maximummotorsports.com/store/index.php?main_page=tech_rear_susp_ta
Going back to the OPs original post, if you decide to go with the PHB and TA setup from MM (guarantee it will be like driving a totally different car), get one of their packages (torque arm, panhard and LCAs).
http://www.maximummotorsports.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_5_504
You will need the MM Full Length SFCs if you dont have them already.
Keep in mind that some exhaust mods will be required and certain tailpipes fit with their Panhard bar.
A PHB and TA setup requires a different spring rate (stiffer spring) in the rear, and use one their custom valved Bilstein HD struts/shocks packages.
Before you drop the $$ to buy:
Read this link thoroughly from MM about their Torque Arms and corresponding components.
http://www.maximummotorsports.com/store/index.php?main_page=tech_rear_susp_ta
