Forums
New posts
Search forums
What's new
New posts
New media
New media comments
New profile posts
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Members
Current visitors
New profile posts
Search profile posts
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Forums
Engine Specific Tech
94-95 5.0 - Specific
Converting a small block 94/95 from MPFI to TBI - in case anyone else wants to go this route
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="shovel" data-source="post: 1588394" data-attributes="member: 29855"><p>This post is going to be about physical fitment. </p><p></p><p>First thing for me was I didn't want to put a cowl hood on the car. I like the way the stock hood looks, I didn't want to buy another hood, etc. </p><p></p><p>Clearance is pretty critical in that case which means intake manifold choices are limited. I think the absolute lowest manifolds possible are the early cast iron ones but they weigh an insane amount. Most single plane or air gap dual plane manifolds are simply too high for a stock hood <strong>period</strong>. If you already have a cowl hood or plan to get one then this part is less of a concern for you.</p><p></p><p><strong><span style="color: rgb(0, 168, 133)">I want to preface this next part: I was not into pony cars/muscle cars/v8's/etc 30 years ago when most of the junk I was driving had a carburetor so I don't know everything about carb intakes, I'll stick to what I do know here. If you're a seasoned hot rodder you probably know a lot more than me about carb intakes. </span></strong></p><p></p><p>The lowest widely available, aftermarket aluminum carb intake seems to be the Edelbrock Performer which states its functional range is idle to 5500 rpm. There's also the Weiand 8124 (or 8120) which is a low-rise dual plane, discontinued but I guess they sold a lot because I saw a lot of them used - it's 3.82" front 4.75" rear. I also found the Weiand #8011 which is very slightly higher (claimed 4.06" front 5.0" rear) and is claimed to have a slightly wider functional range from idle to 6000 rpm and I was able to find a nice clean one for a good price so that's what I went with. </p><p></p><p>That means starting with the Weiand 8011 height of 4.06" front/5.0" rear you can adjust your own calculations based on that. </p><p></p><p>[ATTACH=full]50052[/ATTACH]</p><p></p><p>The Weiand 8011 does connect to the OEM heater tubes your SN95 GT uses. It has a rear water crossover that SN95's don't have in their manifold. It does not have provisions for EGR. </p><p></p><p>I should also state that I am running a stock K-member with no spacers but I do have urethane motor mounts that are specified for a convertible and are <em>supposedly</em> 1/4" lower than stock rubber mounts. <strong> I do not know how true this is</strong> or how much it matters I'm only adding it to the thread because we're dealing with tight clearances here and every variable should be on the table.</p><p></p><p>I assume that every TBI is probably similar in height but since I specifically went with Holley Sniper 2, that is 3.28" tall. </p><p></p><p>[ATTACH=full]50053[/ATTACH]</p><p></p><p>This manifold fits the stock water neck outlet, fits the stock heater tubes and thermostat and ECU water temp & gauge cluster thermo sensors. The Holley's included water temp sensor threads into the stock sender housing. This manifold has an exhaust crossover which - in carbureted applications - helps with cold start warmup and helps prevent fuel pooling in the manifold but I don't think that's as critical with EFI so I opted to use steel core intake manifold gaskets which block off the exhaust crossover ports. </p><p></p><p>The specific gasket set I chose is FEL-PRO 1262 S-3 these are not designed to be trimmed for gasket matching but they have generously large port openings and I found there was very little gasket hanging into the intake runners "here & there" to potentially limit flow. Maybe on an absolute max effort build I'd file them back but it was truly trivial intrusion so I left them. The reason I chose that gasket set is it's open in the rear for the rear water crossover and it's closed in the center to close the exhaust crossover and it's steel core so the exhaust crossover won't blow through.</p><p></p><p>Here is a photo of the engine loosely fitted together with the TBI on top:</p><p></p><p>[ATTACH=full]50054[/ATTACH]</p><p></p><p>You might notice that there are tall valve covers on there and some front accessory drive parts are missing.. those relate to other work I'm performing on this car at the same time and are not necessary for fitting the TBI. </p><p></p><p>At this point air filter fitment becomes critical because hood clearance and also because strut bar clearance. Some people may opt to run with no strut bar at all, I didn't want to do that. I already had this BBK strut bar designed to make room for the Cobra intake manifold and it offers somewhat more clearance around the air filter area. I believe if one were to use the stock GT strut bar it would be necessary to use a remotely mounted air filter with a "bonnet" adapter over the carb. </p><p></p><p>A "standard" 14x3" filter would have no chance of fitting here with the strut bar and with the stock hood.</p><p></p><p>A 9x2" filter fits well... with one critical adjustment. Every 9x2" filter assembly I've found has a roughly 20mm (or 3/4") neck on its base which puts the filter assembly just up against the hood. I actually think if you're running the bare element that's probably OK but if you're running any kind of a cosmetic cover over the bare element like I am that's too close for comfort. Removing the hood blanket would make clearance good enough - I didn't want to do that so I cut the neck down.</p><p></p><p>Here it is with a 9x2" open element filter. Engine was running while this photo was taken. In this photo the 20mm housing base plate neck had been removed, so this is sitting ~20mm lower than it would with the stock filter housing.</p><p></p><p>[ATTACH=full]50060[/ATTACH]</p><p></p><p>In this following photo, I put my action camera and a LED light around where the fuse box is and closed the hood while the camera was recording video, then closed the hood. Note that in this image the 20mm air filter base neck is still present, I had not yet cut it down. Since I was recording video I was also able to see if the hood put pressure on it (moved it) as I closed the hood: it did not. So this does actually fit... BARELY. I'm using a cosmetic scoop - in this case a vintage Cal Customs Shaker from the 70s - over the air filter and it's absolutely not necessary so removing that would free up a fair bit of clearance as you can see here - especially after cutting down the filter neck. </p><p></p><p>[ATTACH=full]50062[/ATTACH]</p><p></p><p>I have seen a few videos including I believe an EngineMasters video that indicate a 9x2" filter with a solid lid starts acting like a bottleneck as one gets toward the high side of 300hp but this is a naturally aspirated 302 with a stock cam so honestly if I see 300hp at all I'll consider myself thrilled. This is not a max effort dyno diva.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="shovel, post: 1588394, member: 29855"] This post is going to be about physical fitment. First thing for me was I didn't want to put a cowl hood on the car. I like the way the stock hood looks, I didn't want to buy another hood, etc. Clearance is pretty critical in that case which means intake manifold choices are limited. I think the absolute lowest manifolds possible are the early cast iron ones but they weigh an insane amount. Most single plane or air gap dual plane manifolds are simply too high for a stock hood [B]period[/B]. If you already have a cowl hood or plan to get one then this part is less of a concern for you. [B][COLOR=rgb(0, 168, 133)]I want to preface this next part: I was not into pony cars/muscle cars/v8's/etc 30 years ago when most of the junk I was driving had a carburetor so I don't know everything about carb intakes, I'll stick to what I do know here. If you're a seasoned hot rodder you probably know a lot more than me about carb intakes. [/COLOR][/B] The lowest widely available, aftermarket aluminum carb intake seems to be the Edelbrock Performer which states its functional range is idle to 5500 rpm. There's also the Weiand 8124 (or 8120) which is a low-rise dual plane, discontinued but I guess they sold a lot because I saw a lot of them used - it's 3.82" front 4.75" rear. I also found the Weiand #8011 which is very slightly higher (claimed 4.06" front 5.0" rear) and is claimed to have a slightly wider functional range from idle to 6000 rpm and I was able to find a nice clean one for a good price so that's what I went with. That means starting with the Weiand 8011 height of 4.06" front/5.0" rear you can adjust your own calculations based on that. [ATTACH type="full" width="582px" alt="1780944694137.png"]50052[/ATTACH] The Weiand 8011 does connect to the OEM heater tubes your SN95 GT uses. It has a rear water crossover that SN95's don't have in their manifold. It does not have provisions for EGR. I should also state that I am running a stock K-member with no spacers but I do have urethane motor mounts that are specified for a convertible and are [I]supposedly[/I] 1/4" lower than stock rubber mounts. [B] I do not know how true this is[/B] or how much it matters I'm only adding it to the thread because we're dealing with tight clearances here and every variable should be on the table. I assume that every TBI is probably similar in height but since I specifically went with Holley Sniper 2, that is 3.28" tall. [ATTACH type="full" alt="1780945073323.png"]50053[/ATTACH] This manifold fits the stock water neck outlet, fits the stock heater tubes and thermostat and ECU water temp & gauge cluster thermo sensors. The Holley's included water temp sensor threads into the stock sender housing. This manifold has an exhaust crossover which - in carbureted applications - helps with cold start warmup and helps prevent fuel pooling in the manifold but I don't think that's as critical with EFI so I opted to use steel core intake manifold gaskets which block off the exhaust crossover ports. The specific gasket set I chose is FEL-PRO 1262 S-3 these are not designed to be trimmed for gasket matching but they have generously large port openings and I found there was very little gasket hanging into the intake runners "here & there" to potentially limit flow. Maybe on an absolute max effort build I'd file them back but it was truly trivial intrusion so I left them. The reason I chose that gasket set is it's open in the rear for the rear water crossover and it's closed in the center to close the exhaust crossover and it's steel core so the exhaust crossover won't blow through. Here is a photo of the engine loosely fitted together with the TBI on top: [ATTACH type="full" alt="1780945672276.png"]50054[/ATTACH] You might notice that there are tall valve covers on there and some front accessory drive parts are missing.. those relate to other work I'm performing on this car at the same time and are not necessary for fitting the TBI. At this point air filter fitment becomes critical because hood clearance and also because strut bar clearance. Some people may opt to run with no strut bar at all, I didn't want to do that. I already had this BBK strut bar designed to make room for the Cobra intake manifold and it offers somewhat more clearance around the air filter area. I believe if one were to use the stock GT strut bar it would be necessary to use a remotely mounted air filter with a "bonnet" adapter over the carb. A "standard" 14x3" filter would have no chance of fitting here with the strut bar and with the stock hood. A 9x2" filter fits well... with one critical adjustment. Every 9x2" filter assembly I've found has a roughly 20mm (or 3/4") neck on its base which puts the filter assembly just up against the hood. I actually think if you're running the bare element that's probably OK but if you're running any kind of a cosmetic cover over the bare element like I am that's too close for comfort. Removing the hood blanket would make clearance good enough - I didn't want to do that so I cut the neck down. Here it is with a 9x2" open element filter. Engine was running while this photo was taken. In this photo the 20mm housing base plate neck had been removed, so this is sitting ~20mm lower than it would with the stock filter housing. [ATTACH type="full" alt="1780946209940.png"]50060[/ATTACH] In this following photo, I put my action camera and a LED light around where the fuse box is and closed the hood while the camera was recording video, then closed the hood. Note that in this image the 20mm air filter base neck is still present, I had not yet cut it down. Since I was recording video I was also able to see if the hood put pressure on it (moved it) as I closed the hood: it did not. So this does actually fit... BARELY. I'm using a cosmetic scoop - in this case a vintage Cal Customs Shaker from the 70s - over the air filter and it's absolutely not necessary so removing that would free up a fair bit of clearance as you can see here - especially after cutting down the filter neck. [ATTACH type="full" alt="1780946590408.png"]50062[/ATTACH] I have seen a few videos including I believe an EngineMasters video that indicate a 9x2" filter with a solid lid starts acting like a bottleneck as one gets toward the high side of 300hp but this is a naturally aspirated 302 with a stock cam so honestly if I see 300hp at all I'll consider myself thrilled. This is not a max effort dyno diva. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Random media
Latest posts
R
Our little japanese Mustang in the wilds of Germany
Latest: rezor
1 minute ago
Members Rides
Vibrations at 80+
Latest: RAU03MACH
Today at 2:34 PM
Drivetrain
Converting a small block 94/95 from MPFI to TBI - in case anyone else wants to go this route
Latest: RAU03MACH
Today at 2:24 PM
94-95 5.0 - Specific
4.6l 2v PI tuning, how to just make it run?
Latest: RAU03MACH
Today at 2:18 PM
Engine Swap
C
radiator fan on start up?
Latest: chasingomas
Today at 1:47 PM
96-04 - 2V Specific
Share this page
Reddit
Pinterest
Tumblr
WhatsApp
Email
Share
Link
Forum statistics
Threads
78,589
Messages
1,536,889
Members
16,227
Latest member
Aviator19xx
Members online
07GtS197
rezor
TRS666
PNW Mike
Carrilho-lucas
kas_lar
wmfateam
Forums
Engine Specific Tech
94-95 5.0 - Specific
Converting a small block 94/95 from MPFI to TBI - in case anyone else wants to go this route
Top