Need some help with supercharger install

sinful rides · Mar 15, 2009

I'm putting the car back together with a 351w from the junk yard and a Vortech T-trim I got from A member here(I was told it was rebuilt with no miles). I have a few issues with it though. FYI car is 94 GT with manual trans and Tweecer computer.
1 Where will the power pipe mount? Do I cut a hole in the inner fender? Won't that weeken the car?
2 The car came with an MSD 6AL wired in. Will this work with the boost retard box? Retard box is not installed yet.
3 The car doesn't rev past 3000RPM.
4 I have oil lifting the dipstick handle and spewing on the motor
5 I installed 60lb injectors. Is this too much for a 351?
A few things still need installed that arn't helping it run. Some vaccum lines for FMU, Boost retard box, Exhaust with 02 sensors, and mass air flow.
I will install all tomorrow if I can find out how to run the intake.

Thanks for any help

ProKiller · Mar 16, 2009

1. you'll have to cut a bigger hole close to the strut tower.
2. i wouldn't install the retard box, use the tweecer instead
3. okay, more info here. have you checked your timing? how is it even running if you don't have the mass air flow or o2 sensors on it?
4. do you have a breather on the valve covers or a PVC valve?
5. too much? heck no!
the FMU is pointless with 60# injectors. what fuel pump do you have in the car?

need more info about your combo. what heads, what cam, etc.

sinful rides · Mar 16, 2009

The engine is just a factory ford engine. Factory heads cam and botom end. I was told it has a 190lph intank pump. I don't have any data cables for the tweecer nor do I know how to use it yet so I planned on installing the retard box for now. As for it running I don't know. We started the car with out the charger to make sure all connections were right and we set the distributer in time. The car reved up good with out the charger but as soon as it was on it won't rev now. The EGR is deleted and has a chrome valve cover breather. It was on the car when I got it.

Paul · Mar 16, 2009

1. Yes, you'll need to cut a hole. The power pipe is designed for 302s, not 351s so the fitment isn't the same.
2. A retard box is unnecessary if you have a tuning device likea Tweecer. Program the timing maps accordingly.
3. Of course not, you have no MAF, no tune, no O2 sensors. The car won't even come close to running right without those.
4. You have added a monster blower, removed the crankcase ventilation, and only have one breather. That's not going to be enough. The pressure has to go somewhere.
5. The 60 lb injectors are fine provided you have a properly calibrated MAF, and the correct tune for it. They're probably a bit much for a stock 351 with a blower, but ultimately the tune dictates how well it runs.

You can get rid of the FMU. It is unnecessary with the injectors you are running.

Botttom line - YOU NEED A TUNE. The car WILL NOT run right without it. Further, a 190 lph fuel pump is completely inadequate for a blown Windsor. You need a higher volume pump or pumps to ensure you have adequate fuel supply under boost.

Hope that helps. Make sure you get your "ducks in a row" before you romping on that thing.

Paul.

sinful rides · Mar 17, 2009

I got some stuff done today before I went to work. The exhaust is in with o2 sensors. All vaccum lines ran for blow off valve and FMU. Cut the hole for the power pipe. I will wire in timing retard box and PMAS MAF. Its calibrated for the 60lbs so I was told. My connector on the MAF is different from the PMAS. The previous ower of the car said it hade a 96 MAF on it with 30lb injectors. Maybe the 4.6 is different from 5.0?

Also can I run the MSD 6AL with the boost retard?

Paul · Mar 17, 2009

Make sure you recirculate the air from the BOV - you can't vent to atmosphere. If you're running MAF, then the system has to be "self-contained" or the ECU will not understand and freak out. I have an AEM so it didn't matter for my car. Once again - YOU DO NOT NEED A FMU. Take it off.

I don't know the differences between 4.6 and 5.0 MAF. Perhaps one of the modular guys can chime in.

I'm not sure if you can run the retard with the 6AL. I'd check MSD's literature on their website.

Paul.

Strim95 · Mar 19, 2009

If it's an msd boost timing master it plugs into the 6al box I had one on my 94 cobra.. And is the maf for supercharged application or n/a? Get a 255 intank pump and maybe a trex external

ProKiller · Mar 20, 2009

unless the FMU plate has a 60# it will just plain old not work. take that crap out. even it does have the proper disc in it, its still worthless for your what your running. FMUs are for 24# injectors. your running 60s, its pointless.

the maf you have is fine as long as it is calibrated for the injectors. regardless of what was on the car before, your putting this new one on so its a moot point.

sinful rides · Apr 1, 2009

I got back to work on the car again. I installed the MAF. The 4.6 has a different plug than the 5.0 but same wiring. The idle is steady now but it still won't rev good. It seams like its loaded up with too much fuel. I'll take the FMU off. I'll also change the plugs to NGK v powers 1 heat colder.
I've got 2 more questions
1 should I manually retard the timing by turning the distributor to help with the engine reving?
2 How can I recirculate the air from the blow off valve?

blown98gt · Apr 1, 2009

manually retard timing and you can not recirculate all bov's because a bov is for venting into the atmosphere..

a BPV is what you would need or a bypass valve, vortech bypass valve can be recirculated. There are 2 types of setups for MAF, blow-thru and Draw-thru... to go into a brief explanation, draw thru is MAF is on the end of the power pipe and all the air sucked in before the s/c is all metered.. a Blow-thru which is the best for tuning is basically the opposite, air is sucked in through the power pipe, into the s/c blown out and through the piping.. the MAF sits basically in the normal spot it would with an intake pipe (no s/c) the air is metered before put into the TB.

Draw-thru setups CAN NOT VENT INTO THE ATMOSPHERE.. under no circumstances can they ever be without it screwing up everything.. the air is already metered so when you dump metered air well big problems..

in a blow-thru setup the BOV/BPV are usually closer to the outlet pipe of the s/c and can either be vented into the atmosphere or recirculated into the power pipe.. since the air is not metered then you can dump it where ever.

best thing as far as getting the car running right is let someone tune it, i mean bottom line is you do need a tune...

sinful rides · Apr 2, 2009

So best thing to do is cut the BOV off an get the Vortech bypass valve.
I'm working on the tuning also. I have a Tweecer computer but having trouble loading the operating programs because its not set up for Vista.

Anyone out there ever get Tweecer programs loaded onto Vista? I could really use your help here.

sinful rides · Apr 3, 2009

how many degrees should I retard the timing?

Paul · Apr 3, 2009

Set base timing at ten, then take it to a dyno for a custom tune. I'm telling you, you will blow that motor up without a tune. Even with a tune, that's a tall order for a junkyard 351W - do you know the condition of that motor, or what head gaskets are in it?

MikeF · May 10, 2009

well i have a stock 302 with cheap trw forged pistons tfs stage 3 cam stage 3 tw heads with v1 at 10lbs boost with btm set to take out 1 degree per pound of boost under reg. boost and when i spray a 50 shot of nitrous i take out 2 degrees per pound of boost thats with base timing at 10degrees (spout out) on a stock tune 94-95 comp. 5 speed.it has run that way since last year.only problem was head gasket when i stepped to 75 shot nitrous.grant it its not the best way to do it but if thats all you have you make do with what you have.i have just got quarterhorse and waiting on graig moats to send me a program so i can get started tuning.i want to datalog stock tune with wideband just to see how far im off and how lucky was i if at all.well that just from my past playing with fuel pressure(65 psi) and timing working my was little by little i was able to get my car very streetable no jerking or bucking and pulled really hard up 2 around 4800 and i short shift because i dont trust fact. tune without a wideband to just run it up to 7000 rpm where cam and heads really flow at.cant wait till i get started tuning this thing(might blow it up)good luck and just start on safe side with btm and stock tune watch your fuel pressure under wot