331 questions

[Kemble]

Well the time has come, after making a little over 300 HP to the tires for the last 20K miles the stock shortblock is getting tired. Starting to have blowby and oil control issues. I am pondering the idea of building a 331 for my car. I just wanted to see if what I have now will be a decent package or If I need to look for a better alternative.

I have now a systemax 2 kit, 24# injectors, 75mm TB, Lightning MAF, 1.72 rockers, 1 5/8ths LTs.

I would like to reuse the above mentioned parts. Everything except for the junk systemax cam. I will be using a custom cam from one of the well know cam people. This car is roughly 60% driver and 40% race toy. No emmisions here either.

Just looking to up the power output while I have it tore apart anyways. But am kinda worried about using the holley heads since there are very few 302 let alone 331 combos out there to get an idea of what its capable of. Another battle will be the 64cc chamber these heads have. I know right now the compression ratio is pathetic, I would like to have it 10:1 or more. To do this the heads will either have to be milled quite a bit or dome pistons installed. Which in your opinion would be the better alternative.

And lastly this car will have a 150 shot on it after the engine is broken in. So it needs to be a package suited for that. Thanks in advance for any ideas on this subject.

 

[Nacho]

Why not a 347, they cost just about the same. I keep reading that a 347 will ALWAYS make more power than a 331 with the proper parts. I'm no expert here, just giving you a heads up, and do a lot of research.

http://fordstrokers.com/index.php <---- is the place to go.

 

[ryclef331]

I'm going to say my .02 and just leave it at that...

If you're going to stick with a stock block man...I'd do forged 306 and call it a day. You've already made over 300whp with a stock shortblock. Freshen everything up, new car, lil head work, you'll be even a little MORE than you currently make. Spray it on top of that...and you'll make plenty of power to tax that stock block. I just can not justify sinking excess money only to gain 29 cubic inches...which can easily be made up power wise with a lil more spray or head work, cam, intake, etc. You DID however say, it was a driver...I can understand putting a cheaper stroker kit in it but honestly, if you have any ANY ideas of pushing for more power down the line, I would put all your eggs (money) in one basket (block) just yet... Thats just me and my .02. I wish I never put a 331 in my stock block..

 

[Jasperstang308]

if you plan on a staying na i say go for the stroker. no need to put high dollar parts in a stock block. go for a 347 also. why not get all the cubes you can?

 

[Javi]

suscribing

 

[Mr. OAM]

Whatever you decide to do with your engine, you shouldn't need domed pistons to get 10:1 compression. When your block is hot tanked have them check the deck height. Then use an online calculator to see what compression height pistons you need in order to achieve the desired compression with your combustion chamber volume. If they are not available then have your block decked to a "zero" height and you should have no problem getting pistons for 10:1 (flat top) or more with your combustion chamber size.


Steve

 

[Jasperstang308]

most flat tops will give you at least 10.1 with a stroker, you definitely dont need a domed piston

 

[LAFENATU]

I'm going to say my .02 and just leave it at that...

Just curious - when you say a forged 306...

Forged Pistons - or Crank, Rods, Pistons...

 

[fastgtfairlane]

i think he was speaking of complete forged bottom end rods pistons and crank.

 

[ryclef331]

I'm going to say my .02 and just leave it at that...

Just curious - when you say a forged 306...

Forged Pistons - or Crank, Rods, Pistons...

Stock crank, forged rods and pistons...really, I would just slap some pistons on it and ride out...it wouldn't be garuanteed to hold up as well as forged rods but PLENTY of people have gone pretty fast on the cheap with the same combo on some sauce.

 

[Kemble]

I think I have changed my mind. I am going to keep it a 306 or 308 depending on what it needs. The pistons would have to be way in the hole to Zero deck height the block and have 10:1+ compression with a combustion chamber size of 64cc. Or that is what I am thinking. Most all pistons I have looked at have a compression height of 1.6" if I am correct.

So now the plan of attack is to build a 306 with forged pistons, stock rods (ARP bolts) and crank, Get the Systemax heads ported, install a custom cam, and call it a day. Hopefully the port job on the heads, a custom cam, and a couple of points of compression will up the power enough to keep me happy for a little bit.

 

[ryclef331]

I think I have changed my mind. I am going to keep it a 306 or 308 depending on what it needs. The pistons would have to be way in the hole to Zero deck height the block and have 10:1+ compression with a combustion chamber size of 64cc. Or that is what I am thinking. Most all pistons I have looked at have a compression height of 1.6" if I am correct.

So now the plan of attack is to build a 306 with forged pistons, stock rods (ARP bolts) and crank, Get the Systemax heads ported, install a custom cam, and call it a day. Hopefully the port job on the heads, a custom cam, and a couple of points of compression will up the power enough to keep me happy for a little bit.

With forged flattop pistons (taking 4cc for valve reliefs) 4.030 bore, 3" stroke, zero deck, .021" head gasket thickness (guessing), and 64cc chambers...you'd come up with a C/R of 9.66:1. 58 cc chambers you'd have 10.44:1. Just an FYI.


http://www.csgnetwork.com/compcalc.html

 

[Kemble]

Now I have to figure out if the Systemax heads can be milled to 58 CC's. Plus I really am concerned if the combustion chamber will be altered so much that flame travel will be hurt in the process.

 

[ryclef331]

take the heads to a REPUTABLE machine shop and ask them all of that. A good engine guy will be able to tell you on the spot. I am pretty sure 6cc's can be removed without much drama...

 

[Kemble]

Sounds like a plan. Guess I'll get them milled as much as my machinist feels comfortable with and let it go at that.

 

[LAFENATU]

I would just slap some pistons on it and ride out...it wouldn't be garuanteed to hold up as well as forged rods but PLENTY of people have gone pretty fast on the cheap with the same combo on some sauce.

X 2

That is exactly what I would do.

Don't waste the money on a completely built bottom end in a stock block.

Save that for an A4/R302/Boss

 

[ryclef331]

I would just slap some pistons on it and ride out...it wouldn't be garuanteed to hold up as well as forged rods but PLENTY of people have gone pretty fast on the cheap with the same combo on some sauce.

X 2

That is exactly what I would do.

Don't waste the money on a completely built bottom end in a stock block.

Save that for an A4/R302/Boss

how bout that....we agree on something. ha.

 

[Stangbangin]

fully forged bottom ends in a stock block FTL... minimum forged pistons max forged pistons and rods. that stock crank will do find under whtever you give it

 

[LAFENATU]

I would just slap some pistons on it and ride out...it wouldn't be garuanteed to hold up as well as forged rods but PLENTY of people have gone pretty fast on the cheap with the same combo on some sauce.

X 2

That is exactly what I would do.

Don't waste the money on a completely built bottom end in a stock block.

Save that for an A4/R302/Boss

how bout that....we agree on something. ha.

Something tells me we would agree on almost everything...

 

[ryclef331]

I would just slap some pistons on it and ride out...it wouldn't be garuanteed to hold up as well as forged rods but PLENTY of people have gone pretty fast on the cheap with the same combo on some sauce.

X 2

That is exactly what I would do.

Don't waste the money on a completely built bottom end in a stock block.

Save that for an A4/R302/Boss

how bout that....we agree on something. ha.

Something tells me we would agree on almost everything...

Concur....haha.