Comp Stage 1 PI cams (102500) in NPI bottom - PTV issues?

sk8erord

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Will I have PTV issues running the 102500 cam? I have the NPI bottom end with PI heads. Cam specs are:

-Duration: 262/266 advertised duration
-Duration @ .050": 226/230
-Lift: .550/.550
-113° lobe separation angle
-1400-5400 RPM operating range
 

Silver95bird

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Check the timing, but so long as the ICL isn't lower than about 110 you should be okay. Same as any other PI engine. The contact happens at the edges, which are the same on either. More room than the xe270ah, but still worth checking.
 

OLD H2S

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Learn how to check! Do not trust anyone. How many times do you want to do this??? How much more money will you spend??? YES I AM PISSED! Read, learn from our mistakes. I have a CAI for you, will give you everything you want, for free, yesterday...
CHECK, check then check again. REALLY... 550 lift?? and your going to trust what I tell you?
MY name is MAYHAM, I'm from the commercial. You want a list of names just like you that have come and gone on this site just in the short time I have been here because the did the same thing and did not check and bent all the valves and ended up with 50 pounds of compression and tried to convince them selves that everything is OK.
 
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sk8erord

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Not sure why I upset you so badly. I am checking and asking for experiences specifically to avoid bent valves. I've also called comp themselves and my local tuner, who has built many many mustangs, specifically suggested these cams over the other option I was considering. So yeah, I'm asking around. I've searched here and corral.net as well as other sites specifically for experiences with these cams.
 

01yellercobra

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Are you doing a full head swap at the same time or is it just the cams? I'm assuming you haven't ordered the cams yet.
 

01yellercobra

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Learn how to check! Do not trust anyone. How many times do you want to do this??? How much more money will you spend??? YES I AM PISSED! Read, learn from our mistakes. I have a CAI for you, will give you everything you want, for free, yesterday...
CHECK, check then check again. REALLY... 550 lift?? and your going to trust what I tell you?
MY name is MAYHAM, I'm from the commercial. You want a list of names just like you that have come and gone on this site just in the short time I have been here because the did the same thing and did not check and bent all the valves and ended up with 50 pounds of compression and tried to convince them selves that everything is OK.
To be fair if the valves are bent I can't imagine the engine having even 50psi of compression.
 
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sk8erord

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Are you doing a full head swap at the same time or is it just the cams? I'm assuming you haven't ordered the cams yet.
I already have pi heads with upgraded springs. Just running stock pi cams at the moment.

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OLD H2S

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The stock cams are .525 lift. Any more than that and you had better "trust but verify".
You are building a RR car, you are going to end up removing every nut and bolt on the car, to check , adjust, replace, tune again and again and to check the torque on the lugs nuts every time you go out...Why?
When your not satisfied with the position of the torque curve of the engine and want more torque you will want to advance or retard the cam. It is easy, you can do it with the engine in the car but you must check the VtoP clearance every time. How many times have chains jumped when the engine is turned over before the chain tensioners have pumped up?
But Comp Cams sez.... Try and get them to rebuild your engine.
Shall I post their fine print on cam installs? You are on your own.
This is nothing personal, or about weather you bought my cams or not, you do this check procedure every time.
And I still stand by my statement on the people who were here and are now gone for the same reason. Most of the times when people do it right we see time slips or vids of the car in action or some bragging about how good it turned out. I want you to brag, with pics.
They did the same thing, and said the same thing, my buddy has the same set up and his car runs bla bla..
 

OLD H2S

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IMG_20180322_095631-D.jpg
 

96blak54

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Dang....old h2s preaching it!

He makes a good point though. Lots of folk take on modular engines blindfolded and retain the blindfold while upgrading only cause their brothers step uncles pet rufus sisters second cousin best friend told them "its good". Im not saying the cam companies dont know. Im not saying the cam companies provide disinformation. What i am saying is ...knowledge is power.

Instead of figuring out what works, build it to work! Valve relief them pistons!

Even if you arnt upgrading cams, while the head is off, valve relief the pistons cause you know youll be upgrading later.
 

evilcw311

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Old speaks the truth. Look at his threads and you’ll understand really fast why he speaks up. Don’t take offense to what and how he’s saying it.

As he said, others have listened and bragged later how awesome their cars are. Others didn’t listen and disappeared, more than likely embarrassed after destroying a good motor.

With all that said, I’m the last person to listen to on these mod motors. Get a pushrod if you want to listen to what I have to say!!! :)


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sk8erord

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So I'm going to go ahead and clay the pistons to check PTV. Since I'm removing the heads, I'll have to replace the head gasket (again). Should I just go with the Ford Performance head change kit again, since it has the gaskets and bolts, or should I go with something like the felpro permatorque? I'm not going to do studs since I don't want to fully pull the motor, so I'll just get another set of OEM head bolts. All of my timing components are nearly brand new, I have upgraded springs already. Anything I'm missing?
 

96blak54

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Let me advise about bolts. Only the ford bolts are worth their weight. Any other "factory like" are just plain junk. Ive used both and for me, ill reuse ford factory bolts over "factory like" parts house type bolts.

The ford gaskets are great and the felpro are great. Just be sure surface preparations is on par with the type of gasket.
 
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sk8erord

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Let me advise about bolts. Only the ford bolts are worth their weight. Any other "factory like" are just plain junk. Ive used both and for me, ill reuse ford factory bolts over "factory like" parts house type bolts.

The ford gaskets are great and the felpro are great. Just be sure surface preparations is on par with the type of gasket.
Yup, the plan is to use the Ford OEM head bolts. Might just buy the kit unless there is a compelling reason to use a different gasket. I'm not sure I feel comfortable reusing TTY bolts.
 
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sk8erord

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Oh and are the felpro gaskets thicker than the Ford oem? I can find the crush thickness of the felpro but not the Ford.

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96blak54

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Yup, the plan is to use the Ford OEM head bolts. Might just buy the kit unless there is a compelling reason to use a different gasket. I'm not sure I feel comfortable reusing TTY bolts.
I got understand that. Let me assure you though, ive done the research for you. Ive reused these factory bolts for 3 retorques now, including the initial factory torque. But all this info is useless if you are moving forward with new bolts. Long story short, use ford bolts!
 

OLD H2S

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You have to look up the FelPro numbers. They come from .027 to .052 regularly and in regular series and Permatorque.
 

01yellercobra

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I remember reading and/or hearing that the TTY bolts are good for 6 or 7 cycles. Which would make sense since otherwise Ford would have to replace the mains and such each time the block was bolted down and machined. Would I chance it on one of my builds? Probably not. But then if I'm inside an engine theres a good chance it won't be stock when it goes back together.
 

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