Need Advice/Opinions on Motor Swap

[trplblk96gt]

Ok so the time has finally here...after 4 years of stuff coming up and things getting in the way...I'm going to be able to do a motor swap in my car! I have a 96 Gt and I want to do a 4v swap. After I get my tax return I'll be able to set aside $3k-$4k. With that being said, what would be the best route to take with the budget I have? Would a 96-98 B head be best, or a 99-01 C head be best? I've been looking around for a month just trying to get a feel for the market but I can't find much of anything. Also, this will be a stock swap. I'm not looking to start modding right after I drop it in. I might put a cam in it with exhaust, and MAYBE a Vortech or Procharger with low boost but for right I'm just looking for a stock 4v, with the lowest mileage possible, to replace my stock (never been rebuilt) 2v with 230k miles. I doubt this motor will be the base for the big build I have planned for a few years from now. Any help, advice, or opinions are appreciated.


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[full force]

Cheapest way is to buy a wrecked Cobra, then you have all the parts you need, or if you dont wanna do that, let me know, I buy them all the time for parts cars, I just sold a complete engine.... I have the rest of the swap parts normally also...

 

[D3VST8R96GT]

If your gonna do a build later just buy a long block

You will def want a parts car or at least buy a complete motor with harness

You want c heads - most intake options....

Get a k member long tubes and cams while the motor is out. After you buy a long block w harness and all that you should be out of money if not before hand



The D3V

 

[MustangChris]

Ok so the time has finally here...after 4 years of stuff coming up and things getting in the way...I'm going to be able to do a motor swap in my car! I have a 96 Gt and I want to do a 4v swap. After I get my tax return I'll be able to set aside $3k-$4k. With that being said, what would be the best route to take with the budget I have? Would a 96-98 B head be best, or a 99-01 C head be best? I've been looking around for a month just trying to get a feel for the market but I can't find much of anything. Also, this will be a stock swap. I'm not looking to start modding right after I drop it in. I might put a cam in it with exhaust, and MAYBE a Vortech or Procharger with low boost but for right I'm just looking for a stock 4v, with the lowest mileage possible, to replace my stock (never been rebuilt) 2v with 230k miles. I doubt this motor will be the base for the big build I have planned for a few years from now. Any help, advice, or opinions are appreciated.


Sent from my driver's seat using Tapatizzle 4.6

so, I too did a 4v swap and here are a few pointers:

Are you going power adder? If yes, pick your engine based on that choice. (Turbo, centrifical = B head -- positive diplacement = C head.)

next choose your method of madness. The cleanest, easiest, and most reliable way of doing the swap is to get a donor car (I highly suggest it).
You can do the swap without the computer from the donor car, without the parts from the donor car, etc - but its much easier if you get them.

Skip the modifications for now. Just get it in, and get it working. I spent YEARS and tens of thousands of dollars modifying my 4v swap just to have it blow after 6 weeks.

If you do modifications, do the exhaust for now and call it good. Headers are a pain in the ass.... get them out of the way. after that its easiest to troubleshoot problems on a stock engine.

 

[decipha]

if your doing a 4 valve the most cost effective route would be to score a mark 8 engine, you can snatch the ecu with it as well, 98 would be most ideal with coil on plug

headers don't make much of a difference on the cobra engines, nor do cams, the only way your going to get any power out of it is if you put a blower or a turbo on it, i prefer turbo's, on3 kits can be had rather cheap and are of decent quality, it would be a simple bolt on most likely

now keep in mind the aluminum teksid blocks are only good for about 650rwhp, the mains just rip out the bottom, I've had it happen many times.

if you go with an iron block be sure you drill the block for the 4 valve coolant passages, i personally prefer the windsors over the romeo's just cuz of the main design but its not really a big deal in the grand scheme of things

expect the 4 valve engine to make about 250rwhp unless you do some porting, modifying, and what not

if you search around you can usually find the m112 setups going for a reasonable price, would be worthwhile for the time being

do yourself a favor and get large enough injectors and maf now so you won't have to re tune it later down the line when you throw boost at her
any competent tuner can do a boost prerequisite in the calibration

 

[D3VST8R96GT]

Teksids are good for twice that. 4 bolt mains with jack screws. if you're dropping mains you're using tty hardware which is a mistake, you torqued it wrong or you're out of balance.

The D3V

 

[MustangChris]

if your doing a 4 valve the most cost effective route would be to score a mark 8 engine, you can snatch the ecu with it as well, 98 would be most ideal with coil on plug

headers don't make much of a difference on the cobra engines, nor do cams, the only way your going to get any power out of it is if you put a blower or a turbo on it, i prefer turbo's, on3 kits can be had rather cheap and are of decent quality, it would be a simple bolt on most likely

now keep in mind the aluminum teksid blocks are only good for about 650rwhp, the mains just rip out the bottom, I've had it happen many times.

if you go with an iron block be sure you drill the block for the 4 valve coolant passages, i personally prefer the windsors over the romeo's just cuz of the main design but its not really a big deal in the grand scheme of things

expect the 4 valve engine to make about 250rwhp unless you do some porting, modifying, and what not

if you search around you can usually find the m112 setups going for a reasonable price, would be worthwhile for the time being

do yourself a favor and get large enough injectors and maf now so you won't have to re tune it later down the line when you throw boost at her
any competent tuner can do a boost prerequisite in the calibration

i've heard of much higher numbers from teksids -- (mind you, minimal research went into it, as I jsut pulled a cobra engine.) -- mainly speaking of accufab's drag car.

are you maybe speaking of the WAPs?

ALso, I'm curious on drilling the block for coolant passages. Any info on that? Mine is going to have to come out for a rebuild.

 

[D3VST8R96GT]

The WAPs are 4 bolt mains with dowels.... 01-04 are good to 900.... 05+ are suppose to be as good as teksids. If you throw mains in an aluminum you're gonna throw them in an iron block with the same set up (fastners power level torque specs and tolerances)..... the 1000+ HP like to have thrust bearing braces....

I am building a teksid right now. Crossed my t's and dotted my lower case J's

The D3V

 

[D3VST8R96GT]

Depends on the block for coolant passages

http://www.modularfords.com/threads/152672-4-valve-block-and-2-valve-heads

The D3V

 

[trplblk96gt]

For right now, I'm more or less talking about just a stock motor. From what I've heard/read, I feel like the general consensus is that a C head motor is better (and will provide a better base if I do, in fact, mod this motor). But my main concern right now is the cost. Can I get a C head cobra swap or donor car with decent mileage for $3k-$4k?


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[D3VST8R96GT]

For 3-4k you could build a nice decent short block and put 4v heads and intake on it you'll need to locate it all so expect down time.

You'd be better of finding a mark vii with b heads.... way easier swap. You can find a parts car for under 3k

Look at mps auto salvage

The D3V

 

[D3VST8R96GT]

If you're gonna do a big build down the road just drop a pi motor in it now so it will run and start piecing together a 4v build and swap.

The D3V

 

[MustangChris]

For right now, I'm more or less talking about just a stock motor. From what I've heard/read, I feel like the general consensus is that a C head motor is better (and will provide a better base if I do, in fact, mod this motor). But my main concern right now is the cost. Can I get a C head cobra swap or donor car with decent mileage for $3k-$4k?


Sent from my driver's seat using Tapatizzle 4.6

no.

search for B headed car at that price.


or rebuild your 2v for madddd power at that price.


After my terminator swap I saw a 2v KB car at a show with a 700HP dyno sheet in the windshield.... i was disappointed in my life choices at that point.

 

[D3VST8R96GT]

Poor Chris

Find a 5.4 2v! a full forged fostering assembly (including crank) is as much as I'm gonna pay for my rods and pistons. A used 4.6 forged crank goes for 3-400$. A new forged 5.4 crank is 345$.

For under 2k you can have a built 5.4 pi motor...... the other 1-2k can get mods or save for future build.

The D3V

 

[Mystic SVT]

if your doing a 4 valve the most cost effective route would be to score a mark 8 engine, you can snatch the ecu with it as well, 98 would be most ideal with coil on plug

Do not try and swap an ECU from a lincoln to your coil pack car, you are just opening up a big ass can of worms. Also, mark 8 motors are cast crank (600hp max) with crap cams, only good thing about them is the teksid block.

headers don't make much of a difference on the cobra engines, nor do cams, the only way your going to get any power out of it is if you put a blower or a turbo on it, i prefer turbo's, on3 kits can be had rather cheap and are of decent quality, it would be a simple bolt on most likely

now keep in mind the aluminum teksid blocks are only good for about 650rwhp, the mains just rip out the bottom, I've had it happen many times.

You are either using TTY hardware, cast cranks, or not torquing everything correctly. Teksid blocks are about the strongest aluminum block ford used.

if you go with an iron block be sure you drill the block for the 4 valve coolant passages, i personally prefer the windsors over the romeo's just cuz of the main design but its not really a big deal in the grand scheme of things

expect the 4 valve engine to make about 250rwhp unless you do some porting, modifying, and what not

A completely stock B-head cobra motor will put down 250-265hp, add longtubes, shortrunner intake, UD pulleys, K&N filter/JLT, aluminum flywheel, aluminum driveshaft, 180* thermostat, no cats, IMRC deletes, tune, and you have 300-325hp. C-head motors will make a little more hp but have much more midrange power/torque.

if you search around you can usually find the m112 setups going for a reasonable price, would be worthwhile for the time being

do yourself a favor and get large enough injectors and maf now so you won't have to re tune it later down the line when you throw boost at her
any competent tuner can do a boost prerequisite in the calibration

My responses to your info in red.

 

[Steven]

C head motors are generally speaking a better design. B heads flow more but it's only until you really push them that you see the marginal difference. I run a C head motor in mine, wouldn't go back to a B head for anything. The world is my oyster now considering I can run modified GT500/Ford GT heads, Navi heads, and all the tech for positive displacement blowers are in C heads. It's a lot more fun to drive as well.

 

[Mystic SVT]

C head motors are generally speaking a better design. B heads flow more but it's only until you really push them that you see the marginal difference. I run a C head motor in mine, wouldn't go back to a B head for anything. The world is my oyster now considering I can run modified GT500/Ford GT heads, Navi heads, and all the tech for positive displacement blowers are in C heads. It's a lot more fun to drive as well.

C heads are def better than B heads and have a lot more choices of intakes and can of course run intercooled kenne bell/whipples on them.

As far as what you said about running GT500/GT/Navi heads, well thats a problem on a 4.6L. They are too much head for a 4.6, but if you're building a high compression BB 5.0 or a BB/S 5.3 then the GT500/GT heads would offer more power gains but then you run into the problem of finding an intake for them. As far as running those heads on a 4.6 based block you only have on real intake optioin and that is the FR500C intake which will cost as much as the GT500/GT heads (ask me how I know). The navi heads aren't that good of a head for a 4.6 because the intake ports are too big, they are made for the 5.4's air needs. You can use adapters to run Cobra/Mach intake on the heads but why spend all that money on those sweet heads only to choke them with those intakes.

Running the GT500/GT heads on a 5.4 offers you two options for intake setups...Cobra R lower/upper or GT500 supercharger setup.

 

[96blak54]

Im going to suggest sticking with a built 2v since you plan to force induce. Not much more horsepower can be extracted from the same cylinder size while being pressurised. Rpms and engines breathe ability is about the only way to get more hp but will come at a cost.
Be sure to check out the 2v and 4v dyno sections and compare hp levels between the 2. Youll be surprised