Dang balancer aint got no numbers!

Photonfanatic · Apr 4, 2012

I ordered a Lunati brand harmonic balancer for my car, back when my old one went bad. Had the rubber sticking way out of it. So due to time constraints, and just plain "I don't want to", I had my trusted mechanic put it on. But I told him to set it to the same timing that the old balancer was at. So he did. But now, I want to change my timing myself and the dang thing doesn't have any numbers to tell you where zero is. Just a bunch of lines. So I have no idea where 10 degrees BTDC is. How can I find out?

NXcoupe · Apr 4, 2012

Wow! That sucks man. Only thing to do now is to pull a plug and crank it around to TDC. You need to put your finger in the spark plug hole on #1, rotate the crankshaft around clockwise until there is a burst of air pushes past your finger, continue slowly moving the engine over by hand until the air slows blowing past your finger. Stick a long, thin screwdriver into the hole and slowly, I mean SLOWLY move the balancer watching the screwdriver, it should slowly stop moving and you can mark the balancer at the closest large hashmark as 0. I recommend a 3 buck summit timing tape is in order. As you're looking at the balancer, the numbers to the right are before top dead center, ones on the left are after tdc. The timing tape will help that out as well. Hope this helps man, and be careful cranking around with the screwdriver in there if you've never done it before, slow is the best!

Photonfanatic · Apr 4, 2012

Ok yeah that is one option. But I'm betting there is someone out there with the exact knowledge of those lines, even without the numbers. There is really only one configuration of those lines for modern cars so I just gotta figure out what that is. Maybe if I could see a pic of someone's factory balancer.

framda · Apr 4, 2012

Did you call Lunati or go to their web site? Also with a dist. motor you can pull the dist cap put the rotor on # 1 cylinder to get in the ballpark.

Photonfanatic · Apr 4, 2012

Yeah I will call them tomorrow they are closed right now.

As for pulling the cap, is that really ok to twist the rotor around like that? Do I need to twist it back or something once I'm done? And how close to the ballpark can I get it? Within a couple of degrees? If so, I can find out where 10 and zero are, since it would be right there.

framda · Apr 4, 2012

Dont twist the rotor. you turn the motor over by the crank bolt or by bumping the starter. What you are doing with a timing light is using the electricity that goes to #1 cylinder to flash the timing light on those timing marks on the balancer. You adjust the timing by rotating the distributor around the rotor to adjust the timing of that electricity to the #1 plug. Timing is measured in degrees. These degrees measure how far the crankshaft has made it through a complete revolution (360 degrees) 6-10 degrees before #1 piston is top dead center is close to where you want to be.

Photonfanatic · Apr 5, 2012

Anyone happen to know what size socket the crank bolt is, offhand?

And if I'm facing the car, the balancer will spin clockwise when the engine is running, right? That way I know which way to turn the thing when I'm looking for top dead center.

Musturd · Apr 5, 2012

24mm is crank bolt. Yes clock wise. Like others said use a small screw driver find TDC drop distributor in with rotor facing to number one plug. If she pops and farts pull disturbutor out and turn rotor 180. Straight forward man

framda · Apr 5, 2012

Dizzie is already in

Musturd · Apr 5, 2012

I know this. I'd get a new balancer but that's just me

Venomized · Apr 5, 2012

That long hash across the whole balancer is your 0* mark. Anything to the left is ATDC (after TDC) and everything to the right is BTDC (before TDC) going to the right your going to retard the timing and going to the left your advancing. You want 10* BTDC for stock setting but you can advance it 4* so you can set it at 6* (each small line is 2*)

Photonfanatic · Apr 5, 2012

Musturd said:
I know this. I'd get a new balancer but that's just me

I might do that one day but for now I'm afraid its really not an option for me. Between work, school, and being broke, I just can't right now. Or, I may just pull that one, get all the rust off there, and then use a number punch to install a 0 and a 10 mark once I figure out where those are. Then hit it with a coat of paint. Wouldn't be a bad balancer then.

Venomized said:
That long hash across the whole balancer is your 0* mark. Anything to the left is ATDC (after TDC) and everything to the right is BTDC (before TDC) going to the right your going to retard the timing and going to the left your advancing. You want 10* BTDC for stock setting but you can advance it 4* so you can set it at 6* (each small line is 2*)

I see what you're saying, but if you look at pic number 2, you can see that there are actually two of those long lines that go all the way across the balancer. I take it you are talking about the one in the middle of all the lines, and not the one on the far left, which only has lines to the right of it? (still looking at pic number 2)

framda · Apr 5, 2012

Venomized said:
That long hash across the whole balancer is your 0* mark. Anything to the left is ATDC (after TDC) and everything to the right is BTDC (before TDC) going to the right your going to retard the timing and going to the left your advancing. You want 10* BTDC for stock setting but you can advance it 4* so you can set it at 6* (each small line is 2*)

That would be retarding the timing. 10* BTDC advanced 4* more would be 14*BTDC

Photonfanatic · Apr 5, 2012

Also what do yall mean by putting a "stop" in the hole? Is there a special tool that will tell you when the number 1 piston is at TDC or something ? I am a huge noob at this .

Someoen told me that you can use a 3" 3/8 ratchet extension as a stop. Please forgive my ignorance. But what happens when it "stops". Are you just waiting for the extension to stop rising out of the spark plug hole? Or are you waiting on it to "stop" you from being able to turn the crank anymore with your breakover bar?

framda · Apr 5, 2012

The piston goes up, and then the piston goes down. With that being said, TDC (top dead center) is just that all of the way at the top. The piston has come all of the way up and has not yet start to go down yet. I think you are letting this get overcomplicated. Did you call Lunati to find out exactly where TDC is on the balancer? I think that Venomized was right that the long mark is TDC. call Lunati to be sure if you want,

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It is real simple though. Turn the motor over until the big line is on exactly on the pointer. Remove the dist cap top. Is the rotor pointing to where the spark plug cable for # 1 cylinder is connected? It should be. If so your mark on the balancer is in fact TDC. 10* TDC is 5 marks to the right. Don't over complicate it.

NXcoupe · Apr 5, 2012

I went through the entire procedure for ya. Good luck with it. The crank bolt is a 15/16" socket, they were still standard up through 95. A metric socket will fit over it, but it's a standard bolt. Crank it over with the socket till the rotor is pointing at the terminal where the #1 plug wire connects on the cap, then you will be very close to what is #1 TDC on the balancer.

Photonfanatic · Apr 6, 2012

Thank you so much guys you have been so much help to me. I really appreciate it. I will try do what yall say when it comes to the procedure of finding TDC. I have read up on it some. So to clarify. I'll turn the crank until the rotor points at the place on the cap where the spark plug wire for the number one cylinder, plugs in at. Then, I look at the "pointer" that you use to shine your timing light on when you are setting the timing. Its the little piece of metal that sticks out that helps you set the timing, right?

Ok so once I get the rotor to the number one plug spot on the distributor cap, whatever line (on the balancer) is lining up with that pointer from the angle I'm going to be looking at the pointer at, (like I'm setting the timing, only I won't be setting the timing right then) is going to be the 0 line. I need to mark that as zero. Anything to the left of that zero mark will be before top dead center, and anything to the right will be after top dead center. IF i am lying under the car and looking at the balancer from the back. Like you would if you rolled under it on a creeper. Cause that's how I'll be under there to use my number punch to put numbers on that #@$! numberless balancer lol. Does all this sound right?

framda · Apr 6, 2012

The mark that it will be pointing to will be whatever the timing is set to at that time. This will probably be 6*-10* BTDC.

Venomized · Apr 6, 2012

Make sure your on the compression stroke!! cannot stress this enough! To check that you just pull the #1 plug and put your finger over the hole and when you feel it pushed away and hear a hiss your on the right stroke. Take it to TDC from there and then proceed to 10* BTDC