5.4 ?????

[r3dn3ck]

No way.....Your telling me if I had a 14.0 second Pi vert 96-98 made it a 5.4 it would run like 12.9?
Thats unbelievable ...literally...I dont beleive it would do that much....maybe from 14.0 to like 13.3

Whether or not you can believe it, the fact remains. The hardest part is hooking up the power. Don't kid yourself into thinking that it's easy to drive a car that piles torque on like these things.

jeez..if thats true...swapping pi heads with a 5.4 block might be more worth it than slapping a blower on the crappy npi heads.

If im running high 13s trapping 102 now...according to that I would be solidly into the 12s..which is probably where id be with a blower...

With cams and a decent intake you'll make the same peak numbers as you would with a blower on 8lbs through npi heads on stock cams. Even with NPI heads on the 5.4 I'm pretty sure you could trap solid 12's on motor with a 5.4. Adding cams to NPI heads isn't a huge loss either. Whatever you do, don't get caught up chasing dyno numbers. People get stressed out about making this much hp and that much tq. Make what you make, know why you're making what you make.

thanks for the response, i don't remember which heads does the 5.4 out of a navigator has..if they are different, which heads should i use, the ones on the 5.4 or the b-heads of my 4.6? ... getting interested and i haven't finished another proyect yet... lol

Navi heads are really close to R heads. They have huge intake ports that suck on 4.6's but rock on 5.4's just like B heads. I like ported B heads better than any other but that's personal bias. They have monster port volume and flow pretty big either ported or not (port em'). Getting an intake to fit B-heads will be a little harder but Al Papito is going to be a good person to ask there. If nothing else, port a set of c heads and use some adapter plates or a kar-kraft setup.

 

[voidfinger]

i say just use the karkraft set up... then you don't have to worry with the odds and ends... just use the whole motor. Anyway, Red .. you didn't answer my previous question. did anyone make any headway on the 3v 5.4 swap? intake? or plates? I was wondering about the 5.4 4v Bheads anyway. Wonder if you could use the plates but its probably just like the 3v's b/c the angle into the heads are strait down... hmmm. I was thinking that since i'm probably going to park the mustang and get a beater to be a DD i would think about a 5.4 Lightning swap... but a 5.4 3v and 4v sounds nice too.

 

[r3dn3ck]

i say just use the karkraft set up... then you don't have to worry with the odds and ends... just use the whole motor. Anyway, Red .. you didn't answer my previous question. did anyone make any headway on the 3v 5.4 swap? intake? or plates? I was wondering about the 5.4 4v Bheads anyway. Wonder if you could use the plates but its probably just like the 3v's b/c the angle into the heads are strait down... hmmm. I was thinking that since i'm probably going to park the mustang and get a beater to be a DD i would think about a 5.4 Lightning swap... but a 5.4 3v and 4v sounds nice too.

There's a guy in Kentucky that did a 3v swap into his car. He seems pretty happy with it so far but he's a tinkerer and he did a lot on his own. There's no intake or plates yet for 3v but as soon as we've got the 2v intake launched I'll ask for a 3v intake based on the same design.

Decide on how much effort you want to spend on it. Lightning swaps are neat but I don't like em' without upgraded rods. 3v is a 400rwhp machine waiting to happen. I think you could even make an intake pretty cost effectively but if nothing else I can put you in touch with someone that maybe able to whittle you out a set of 3v plates.

B heads are about ideal if you can't land navigator heads but both will require you to make intake decisions. For practicality, find a set of used ported c heads and slap in some lumpy cams with as much lift as you can get. Use a 01 cobra or mach1 intake and a set of plates.

Kar-Kraft crate engines are a really cost effective way of just getting the damned thing done but they leave a lot or room for upgrades.

DO YOUR UPGRADES BEFORE YOU INSTALL THE ENGINE. THE VALVE COVERS WILL NOT COME OFF WITH THE ENGINE IN THE CAR.

 

[brightwhite98GT]

Is it a streetable, and reliable motor?

edit: http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=8447 <- good block to buy, if you wanted to build it up from the ground?

 

[voidfinger]

Is it a streetable, and reliable motor?

edit: http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=8447 <- good block to buy, if you wanted to build it up from the ground?

Looks like a base block... stock really.

 

[voidfinger]

i say just use the karkraft set up... then you don't have to worry with the odds and ends... just use the whole motor. Anyway, Red .. you didn't answer my previous question. did anyone make any headway on the 3v 5.4 swap? intake? or plates? I was wondering about the 5.4 4v Bheads anyway. Wonder if you could use the plates but its probably just like the 3v's b/c the angle into the heads are strait down... hmmm. I was thinking that since i'm probably going to park the mustang and get a beater to be a DD i would think about a 5.4 Lightning swap... but a 5.4 3v and 4v sounds nice too.

There's a guy in Kentucky that did a 3v swap into his car. He seems pretty happy with it so far but he's a tinkerer and he did a lot on his own. There's no intake or plates yet for 3v but as soon as we've got the 2v intake launched I'll ask for a 3v intake based on the same design.

Decide on how much effort you want to spend on it. Lightning swaps are neat but I don't like em' without upgraded rods. 3v is a 400rwhp machine waiting to happen. I think you could even make an intake pretty cost effectively but if nothing else I can put you in touch with someone that maybe able to whittle you out a set of 3v plates.

B heads are about ideal if you can't land navigator heads but both will require you to make intake decisions. For practicality, find a set of used ported c heads and slap in some lumpy cams with as much lift as you can get. Use a 01 cobra or mach1 intake and a set of plates.

Kar-Kraft crate engines are a really cost effective way of just getting the damned thing done but they leave a lot or room for upgrades.

DO YOUR UPGRADES BEFORE YOU INSTALL THE ENGINE. THE VALVE COVERS WILL NOT COME OFF WITH THE ENGINE IN THE CAR.

More than likely i would get the lightning motor and then tear it down... keep the pistons, put in h beams from TMD, get it balanced really well. ARP head and main bolts. Good head gasket with some dead soft or whatever exaust gaskets... Long tubes, Stage 3 heads, Custom Supercharger cams, and about 14 psi. I think that would be a hellava improvement... i would think it would be at least 480/500 flywheel hp and about 400 rwhp or a little more

O and by the way Red, what other stuff could you recommend for the lightning swap? I'm thinking either stay with my 3.27's or go with 3.55's and maybe a stall ? also you know any good deals on some lightning motors? what is normal for them? i've seen them on ebay for like 4k complete up to 6k complete...

 

[r3dn3ck]

More than likely i would get the lightning motor and then tear it down... keep the pistons, put in h beams from TMD, get it balanced really well. ARP head and main bolts. Good head gasket with some dead soft or whatever exaust gaskets... Long tubes, Stage 3 heads, Custom Supercharger cams, and about 14 psi. I think that would be a hellava improvement... i would think it would be at least 480/500 flywheel hp and about 400 rwhp or a little more

O and by the way Red, what other stuff could you recommend for the lightning swap? I'm thinking either stay with my 3.27's or go with 3.55's and maybe a stall ? also you know any good deals on some lightning motors? what is normal for them? i've seen them on ebay for like 4k complete up to 6k complete...

The kar-kraft solution is nice. You get everything except the rods and a quick balancing done for you. On that combo though I'm betting closer to 450+rwhp and 550+tq or more, so I'd add a built tranny to the list (lightnings came with a 4r100 which you may be able to retrofit... maybe). With a blower, stay with the lower gears. 3.55's are great for me.. anything more seems excessive for most street applications. A lightning bottom end should be less than 1500 bucks. Anything more is kinda silly without upgrades. I know for a fact if you guys take 1500 bucks over to my thread at Mustangboards.com and talk to chip you'll be able to buy his motor which is unassembled but has PIMP components. You'll be getting a motor with 1200 bucks in the rods and pistons already, not counting the bearings, crank, etc...

 

[voidfinger]

karKraft has lightning motors?

 

[Jrgunn5150]

KarKraft has everything if you have cash...

 

[voidfinger]

lol i saw three pieces of the blower set up and it was like close to 1700 for those pieces...

 

[Jrgunn5150]

Yeah they are pricey, but on the other hand you know what you are getting and where it's been. Maybe one of those Aston Martin motor's will fit a GT...

 

[voidfinger]

naw, all i want is a lightning motor. used and one i can rebuild.

 

[Steven]

i'm wondering if it would be possible to hit the 400 rwhp mark on a 10.5-11:1 5.4 with stage 3 heads, custom cams, ported hardball'r etc.. it would be nice if you could.. it would still be street friendlly.. the torque would be unrea to.. i would love to build me one of those.. i just so happen to have a brand new 5.4 ford crate motor at the shop

 

[Jrgunn5150]

You can hit 400 rwhp N/A with a 32v...

 

[r3dn3ck]

i'm wondering if it would be possible to hit the 400 rwhp mark on a 10.5-11:1 5.4 with stage 3 heads, custom cams, ported hardball'r etc.. it would be nice if you could.. it would still be street friendlly.. the torque would be unrea to.. i would love to build me one of those.. i just so happen to have a brand new 5.4 ford crate motor at the shop

with a 2v don't count on 400rwhp being possible with 2v heads. They just don't flow enough to get there. Much more than 360rwhp is just not streetable on the 2v heads. 3v heads with a big hogging out done to them maybe... 4v heads definitely.

If you have a 5.4 2v, then have the heads race ported with bigger valves & hardened seats, PM me for some cam specs, bore the block .030 over, grab some H-beams and a set of flat top slugs. Make sure you use a windage tray, high volume oil pump and ARP studs all around. Use the new HPS intake (when it's out in a month or 2) and longtubes. You'll make the power you want. Don't forget that a 50 shot of giggle gas is something you can do dry and it's cheaper than upgrading to 3v heads.

 

[Steven]

well whats more street friendly red.. a n/a 400rwhp 32v or a 2v.. im wondering if it could happen on set of stock cammed 32v heads.. just trying to decide the most beneficial.. i don't have alot of money, and the last thing i want to do is make my car a pain to drive everyday if i decide to. I guess though you have to look at the torque before the hp.. a nice setup like yours with the intake and LT's would probably be more then enough to get you in the 11's right?

 

[Jrgunn5150]

A decent 5.4 2v and suspension would get you to 11's, but 400 rwhp N/A 4.6 4v would be more streetable than the 2v, although probably not cheaper.

A set of ported heads, cams, and FR500 intake would nail 400 rwhp easy, but expensive.

 

[r3dn3ck]

well whats more street friendly red.. a n/a 400rwhp 32v or a 2v.. im wondering if it could happen on set of stock cammed 32v heads.. just trying to decide the most beneficial.. i don't have alot of money, and the last thing i want to do is make my car a pain to drive everyday if i decide to. I guess though you have to look at the torque before the hp.. a nice setup like yours with the intake and LT's would probably be more then enough to get you in the 11's right?

a 400rwhp 2v just isn't really possible as a street car so a 4v would be more streetable by default if the magic 400rwhp number is a mandate. If you do look at the tq curve before the hp curve you'll be in a better position to estimate the performance. Stock cams won't get you to 400rwhp on a 4v. We know that or you'd see 400hp ratings out of the box. Figure on a set of custom grinds or just grab any old set of stage 2 4v cams. I think 2v is much easier and cheaper to do for a 2v car, 4v for a 4v car. Either trim is perfectly streetable but the 2v takes a little more throttle discipline down at low rpm (it's pretty easy to ROAST the tires with either but the 2v has more low end grunt).

I'm pretty sure I'll be deep into the 12's as it sits and nearing 11's on street tires after the intake and header upgrade, so adding a small shot of nitrous should dip me into high 11's if I can drive it as it is. Remember, my setup isn't even done yet and it's already handing asses to WS6 drivers (killed one a couple nights ago from a dig). Adding more power at this point is just finishing what I had planned and not totally for the need of more ... there's no need for more power than it has now on the street.

A decent 5.4 2v and suspension would get you to 11's, but 400 rwhp N/A 4.6 4v would be more streetable than the 2v, although probably not cheaper.

A set of ported heads, cams, and FR500 intake would nail 400 rwhp easy, but expensive.

Ported heads, good cams with 230deg duration and a nice free flowing intake like the FR500 or 01 Cobra intake should be really neato. I thought heavily about starting with a 4v but I decided to start 2v and if that just couldn't make me happy I'd do the 4v. I'm pretty demanding and really... this 2v 335cid is plenty strong for me.



Last night on the way home I did a launch from a light and after it finally hooked up and started moving, I shifted to second and it hooked till it hit about 45mph, then the rear end lost its hold on the pavement and spun HARD again. This isn't barking the tires with a power shift.. this is smokin' the hides from flooring it at 45mph. It breaks traction on the 2-3 shift pretty hard but at least it grabs hol't after the initial spin and gets to moving.

 

[voidfinger]

So this is with the adapter plates? just wondering lol. Hmmm, it doesn't sound so bad now. I would really like to fall into a lightning also...or maybe even a 3v. Would a 3v have the low end grunt of the 2v? I'm thinking some gearing and some 315 M/T ET Streets and some 31 spines... that should hold the grunt well lol.

 

[r3dn3ck]

yep.. killed with plates adapting my intake. A 3v motor will keep all the tq and a few more. HP will will be able to pass 350rwhp with ported 3v or stock 4v heads. Past 450rwhp with ported 4v heads.