Tuners vs Chips

[Orange 94]

Also, I'd rather support and meet a local tuner rather than have some micky mouse on the other side of the world take my money and give me a tune.

 

[decipha]

explain this. How do you feel 351hp rather than 349hp?

I could care less what you say. Its always better to have a person with the car.
Ideally you'd have the tuner drive it and have it on the dyno. Thats expensive and not always available.

I'll always be a strong believer it dyno tuning.

you don't have to feel it, hp is simply calculated by distance, weight, and time, there's a bunch of hp calculators on the internet that will give you a HP number based on your track time

regardless what you believe or how you feel, running down the 1/4 mile is the purest method to dialing in the most optimal tune, you cannot dispute the 1/4 mile results

if dyno tuning works for you and you have a tuner that you trust, that is all that matters, at the end of the day the only thing that matters is if you and your engine is happy, how you get there matters not

Also, I'd rather support and meet a local tuner rather than have some micky mouse on the other side of the world take my money and give me a tune.

whats the difference between that same tuner doing a remote tune for you as well? most dyno tuners do online / remote tuning as well, for you the option for a local tune is available, for others that live in countries where dyno tuning is non existent, their only viable option is to get a remote / street / online tune

again, i will emphasis, a local tuner is USUALLY your best bet, however verify your tuner is knowledgeable and knows what he or she is doing.

Just for clarification, my purpose in posting in this thread is to clarify that the method to tuning is not a direct indication of engine performance, the most optimal tune can only be achieved by someone that is aware how the engine is functioning and has the knowledge to make it perform in the manor they desire, I'm not trying to dispute your opinion or convince you to tune your vehicle otherwise, I'm simply relaying informative information for you (and others) to be better educated in various tuning methods

 

[rz5.0]

I never been to tuner. I would rather learn it than pay someone. Personally I think dynos are over rated. I could be wrong but that's my opinion. . They simulate a wot pull and datalog.. You can do that on your own. To me a dynos is only good to know how far you can push thing before you stop making power..

 

[Orange 94]

how do you calculate power of a 1/4 mile time? Theres too many variables, who says all that power is actually being put down. What about when you loose traction? You could spin all the way down that track and it doesnt mean you have 100hp.


To my knowledge there is no one in my area that remotes tunes, and if there is I wouldnt necessarily trust them. All the good tuners in my area use dynos.

 

[ttocs]

those local guys with dynos may very well be doing them remotely. If they can have someone email them a datalog, make the adjustments and mail it back there is no reason they would not like easy money. I personally will be going to a local guy after trying one from bama prior to him tuning it the 1rst time. I too would rather have someone that I can meet/see then hoping they respond to an email/text but I am becoming an old fogey as I type. I am so old I just farted and dust came out... OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOn 2nd though that might have been coke actually

 

[decipha]

horsepower is a calculation of distance and time which can be calculated by a roller

1 hp = 33,000 foot-pounds of work per minute

hp can be calculated using the following calculator
http://www.wallaceracing.com/et-hp-mph.php

horsepower is not measured on a dyno its 'calculated' just as it is in that calculator

as for loosing traction, dyno's do have the inherent problem of slipping wheels/converters as well that will skew results

the 1/4 mile calculation CANNOT be disputed, take a look at some of the supra / terminator folks, some make some serious power but still can't get out of the 11s to save their life

would you rather a 1000hp supra that runs 11.9s or a 350hp fox with an explorer engine swap and cam that runs 11.8s ???

the dyno hp number should not be used for direct comparisons of dissimilar engine combo's, a dyno is nothing more than a big a$$ torque wrench to let you know if your change is positive or negative, nothing more, nothing less

 

[95opal]

A tune no matter dyno, remote, or self tuned is only as good as the guy tuning it!!! If your local dyno guy is a dumb @ss then guess what? Same can be said with sending out for a remote tune. When I built my motor back in 06 I needed a start up tune, so I did some research and decided to go with a remote tune from [email protected] . I made that decision based on his reputation as being one of the best in the country with 94-95 ecus and some personnel references of people I knew I could trust and had used him. It took a couple of datalogs to nail it but the car idled and ran perfect, never had to do a thing after that. I will more than likely be using him for my new set up this spring as I was completely happy with my first experience using him and the fact that there isn't a dyno tuner in my area that I could actually say I trust as much as I trust Don. So in the end it doesn't matter how its tuned as decipha stated.

Orange 94 ..As for calculating hp from 1/4 mile times that's how its done always has, mathematics don't lie son.

 

[Orange 94]

As with a dyno, there will still be errors in 1/4 mile calculations.

I just see more with 1/4; tires, driver to driver, aerodynamics....

 

[Nightmare]

the 1/4 mile calculation CANNOT be disputed, take a look at some of the supra / terminator folks, some make some serious power but still can't get out of the 11s to save their life

would you rather a 1000hp supra that runs 11.9s or a 350hp fox with an explorer engine swap and cam that runs 11.8s ???

1,000hp supras.....lol you realize that a lot of how a car goes down the strip is due to the suspension setup when you are at that power level....and weight. There was a poster with Carl Lewis on it that had him in a uniform that looked like the tire design (I believe it was Michelin) that said "Power is nothing if you cant get it to the That right there is the difference between two cars that make 1,000 hp and weigh the same.

A dyno is great for finding problems under load, finding your shift points, ect and is to be used as a tool in tuning. I would take a dyno tune over a tune done while driving any day....People like Bob Kuregan, Mike Post, Marv at C@M Performance, and optima batteries challenge sponsor West Bend Dyno all agree with that. Other big name tuners do too.

This statement is true to a point "the dyno hp number should not be used for direct comparisons of dissimilar engine combo's, a dyno is nothing more than a big a$$ torque wrench to let you know if your change is positive or negative, nothing more, nothing less ". It should be used as a tool, and factored into an equaision, however isnt everything....

 

[Shifty Powers]

Actually remote tuning nowadays, especially for newer cars, is just as good as dyno tuning. Mainly when you have someone competent on what they are doing.

Obviously circumstances change and people with unique setups or much larger ones sometimes do need to come in for a dyno tune. (sometimes only the first time). Even with those setups good tuners record what they do. So once they know what works for what setup, they can then use that data to properly remote tune another car with the same mods.

In the case of the OP. A dyno tune. is NOT worth the extra money and wont be until he has some sort of FI. Even then the car may not need much adjustment if all the mechanics are right and a remote tune could get it dialed in within a datalog or 2.

 

[ElKabong197]

Yep, for bolt ons, an email tune is just as good as a dyno tune. You obviously might be able to squeeze a FEW more hp out of a tune on the dyno, but it doesn't really justify the cost.

Sent from my Galaxy S fizzledizzle using Tapatizzile Twizzle

 

[decipha]

Even with those setups good tuners record what they do. So once they know what works for what setup, they can then use that data to properly remote tune another car with the same mods.

it doesn't exactly work that way, the only things you can really take away knowledge wise are an idea of ignition timing and airflow modeling

the MAF sensor is what the tune is based on, you can have two identical setups with different MAFs and you'll have two completely different tunes depending on if one of the MAFs have to be scaled, granted it should be a percentage of the other tune but it doesn't always work out that way

Yep, for bolt ons, an email tune is just as good as a dyno tune. You obviously might be able to squeeze a FEW more hp out of a tune on the dyno, but it doesn't really justify the cost.

if all you have done is bolt ons a dyno cant get you anything more than an email tune can, unless you get an email tune from "mickey mouse"

 

[Shifty Powers]

it doesn't exactly work that way, the only things you can really take away knowledge wise are an idea of ignition timing and airflow modeling

the MAF sensor is what the tune is based on, you can have two identical setups with different MAFs and you'll have two completely different tunes depending on if one of the MAFs have to be scaled, granted it should be a percentage of the other tune but it doesn't always work out that way



if all you have done is bolt ons a dyno cant get you anything more than an email tune can, unless you get an email tune from "mickey mouse"

Dude. I never said the tuning would be EXACTLY the same from one to the other. But each tune you do with each setup on certain cars gives you more and more knowledge of what will and what will not work. Other than already knowing what you are doing.

Your nitpicking over a few words here or there. I was putting it a different way while agreeing with you.

But I am done talking in here now. Good day sir

 

[AJCrader]

I was seriously entertained here...I have no clue about tuning, but this went on way longer than it needed to!!!

AWESOME!!!

 

[decipha]

Dude. I never said the tuning would be EXACTLY the same from one to the other. But each tune you do with each setup on certain cars gives you more and more knowledge of what will and what will not work. Other than already knowing what you are doing.

Your nitpicking over a few words here or there. I was putting it a different way while agreeing with you.

But I am done talking in here now. Good day sir

its difficult to express intent on the inter web, i didn't mean to nitpick if that's how you perceived it, i was just stating as a general overview, i didn't mean to offend, my apologies