Which engine swap do YOU think is best?

[bany95]

Gentlemen (and Ladies),

I am in the midst of deciding on a new engine for my 1995 'Vert.

My original plan was to buy a 408/418 crate engine, and use a Trickflow style throttlebody / intake ($10,800 at Coast High Performance). But then I spied the new coyote 5.0 crate engine, which would combine decent power with stock Ford reliability, and a cool factor ($8,800 from FRPP for the engine and harness). Recently I came across a used 03-04 cobra engine & trans for $10,500... making the decision even more difficult!

The car isn't a DD, but needs to be reliable enough for about 5000 miles per year. Right now the car is a 5spd, but I will be switching to a T-56 with the engine swap (stock cobra, or the new Magnum).

The car already has a tubular front end and MM suspension all around, and a Baer/Cobra brake combo.

 

[Dysfunction]

I vote Termi, just because of the insane power potential reliability. But the new 5.0 would be amazing to have in a '95 5.0...

 

[Naptown_Stang]

if you got that tranny and the cobra motor that is by far the best option! Also cjponyparts.com has a great deal on the 2011 crate 5.0 i think its 6,000 there

 

[Mntlkase]

termi motor. Oustanding power potential, parts are readily available, and you could prolly negotiate that 10.5 price down to 8 or so.....

 

[duh09]

A Coyote 5.0 would be awesome but my vote is for the 408 stroker. There's no replacement for displacement!

 

[bany95]

duh09,

So a roadracing guy like yourself would still take the slower rev'ing, heavier 408 vs an all aluminum coyote 5.0 that rev's to 7000 out of the box?

 

[BlkoutGT]

You really couldnt go wrong with any of the three. The 408 would be the easiest of the three to swap. Termi motors are simply B/A but I imagine either of those modular motors would be a pita to swap over. And I'd hate to work on either of those, but if you wanted stock(ish) reliability and pretty good mpg's then either of those mod motors would fit the bill. I think it would come down to your budget.

 

[Dysfunction]

Not in the vote, but for the budget ya could also stick with a 302 base. 331/347 boosted would be beast, and much easier. But I'm assuming you've thought of this, which is why the vote is for the others. Good luck with what ever ya do! All of em will be badass.

 

[Steven]

You'd pretty much be wise to just buy a new 5.0, and do small things to it, wax it on multiple occassions, keep it covered, and avoid the hassle and money that it will take to build the car to any sort of status beyond heavy or slow. When it comes to speed, there is a real advantage to buying the newer tech, and sometimes that requires a whole other car.

 

[bany95]

In my old age, I have realized that it is easier and cheaper to buy a fast car than to build one :BangHead:

If I had to do it over again, I'd do it different...but it's too late, because I'm too far into this money pit that I call a Mustang to sell it and buy a new 5.0 (or even a complete Termy).

Building a 302/347 really isn't what I'm looking for right now, I don't want to take the easy way out.

 

[duh09]

duh09,

So a roadracing guy like yourself would still take the slower rev'ing, heavier 408 vs an all aluminum coyote 5.0 that rev's to 7000 out of the box?

First, not a roadracer, just a newb Autocrosser. Working my way there though lol.

It seems like it'd just be easier to fit a 351W stroker in there. Like I said, a Coyote motor would be sweet, but your car is practically setup for a big stinking 351 to sit between the strut towers. Plus I'm just a diehard pushrod guy who doesn't know the first thing about modulars. lol

 

[ryclef331]

Well most know what my response is...and its not on the list. I'm not going to go into my justifiication to avoid the pending monkey poo fight that would probably result...but...well...see my signature.

 

[Adam95GT]

ls1...

 

[jabird]

I'd do the Cobra motor and transmission; especially since you already have the K-member out! Be sure and get all the harnesses and brains to change out that balky old 302! Good luck, and let us know what you decide!

 

[NmcgrawJ]

$8k towards a LSX swap would be an incredible setup.



What's your budget? We're discussing motor vs motor vs motor/trans.


How about wiring and such for the mod motors? Hydroboost? Do the 11+ run Hydroboost still?

 

[ProKiller]

a coyote would be fantastic but will the hardest to pull off probably. your going into uncharted water with that swap. the 408 is tried and true. the 03 cobra has been done before so there is some experience there.

 

[bany95]

The only thing that really concerns me about the Coyote swap, is the fact that the 2011 mustangs have electric steering... meaning I'd have to fabricate up my own power steering pump brackets for the motor, or switch to a manual rack (flamming river).

The car is a '95, so it already has the vacuum brake booster, meaning that the hydroboot isn't a problem.

I thought briefly about an LSx swap, but I think that I'd like to stick with a ford motor (just for continunity, I'm not saying that the fords are better, I don't want to start that again).

Budget:
I'd like to keep it around $10k for the motor and harness, then the trans/clutch/bellhousing would be extra (plus fuel, cooling, etc). In the case of the Termi set-up, I would likely budget in a re-build (used engine, internal condition unknown)... which would bring it up to about the same price as the other two options (with the lowest HP in stock trim, but maybe the most potential).

Andrew

 

[cantbuytime]

i must agree that and LS swap would be your best bet. if u just want a different power train..

But if u must stay Ford power then find you a shop to build that 408. For $10k it better make 1000hp..

The only cool swap would be the Coyote Motor..

AND

why not just buy a Cobra if you want that motor

I almost went to a 351 but If I am going through the trouble of changing to a different power plant, then make it worth while.

 

[auto_x5.0]

Everybody wants to do a Termi swap...but a clean 408w that can make a ton of power on its own is great, now amazing is a 408w w/ a single 66mm hairdryer and a good 16#-18# of boost(something streetable).
You cant go wrong with good ol fashioned pushrod power

 

[bany95]

Thanks for the input guys, all valid points. And really, I can't go too wrong with any of the options :thumbsup:


I was surprised at how little $10k will buy you in the crate engine market... granted I might be able to build it cheaper with used parts, but for an apples to apples comparison;

Thru Coast High Performance (I only used them as an example because the website is pretty detailed), a 408W crate motor with AFR205 heads, and an edlebrock victor TB intake (ie stock computer) is advertised at 525hp/520ft-lb, and has an MSRP of $10,789.99.
http://www.coasthigh.com/product-p/12360-ps-f408w-tbv.htm

And I highly doubt that a 408 on 16-18 psi is streetable... did you see the MMFF article with the DSS 408W with a 60mm HP turbo kit running at 7psi? 725HP at 6000 RPM, 714ft-lb at 4900 RPM, and 681 ft-lb right down at 2600 RPM. Traction would be a very scarce commodity with that torque :nono:
http://www.dssracing.com/v/vspfiles/photos/Articles/inches%20and%20pounds.pdf

The other caveat to all of this is that the car is a 'vert, and I don't plan on running a full 10pt cage... meaning that the flimsy chassis (even with SF connectors) won't handle huge torque for very long before tearing itself appart.