Engine swap planning - analysis paralysis

[07GtS197]

I'm not opposed to centrifrugal blower, but I've never heard one in person that doesn't whistle at idle or low throttle. And this car has to pass the wife test lol

That said you can throw forced induction out the window lol.

 

[FullstackViking]

That said you can throw forced induction out the window lol.

Positive displacement blowers like the VMP, Whipple, or KB aren't loud at idle or around town like turbos and centrifrugals are though

 

[07GtS197]

Maybe not at idle but under load they do.

 

[Snorky]

Quite-r centrifugal blowers have helical cut gears, vortech v3 falls into that category. Also dont vent to atmosphere and it will also be quieter. Are you looking for power level of todays cars stock? Or modified?

 

[ttocs]

They sell a close-ratio T56 Magnum and I have a 3.73 rear end as well, so it gets a little muddy lol

I have the close ratio and 3.55s. I like the total package although I have not driven it enough by any means....

 

[ttocs]

I'm not opposed to centrifrugal blower, but I've never heard one in person that doesn't whistle at idle or low throttle. And this car has to pass the wife test lol

my vortech v3 is quiet

 

[Rons95GT]

My Paxton Novi 2000 with helical gears is quiet. Other mustangs wanted to run me before and didn’t know I had one. Then they wondered what happened.

 

[Makoto]

aluminum block 2v rebuild with an aftermarket top end because you forgot the biggest pro: you'll shave 85lbs off the front end immediately
I think the aluminum blocks need one hole drilled for coolant for the GT heads and other than that its a direct swap.

that + higher compression pistons + twisted wedge heads/cams would probably get you over 400crank hp and have a top end that just goes and goes.

that with some 4.10's and you'd be hurting some feelings and you'd save a TON of headache.

when people tell you "its basically plug and play" they are usually full of shit. nothing aftermarket, nothing swapped, none of it, unless it is literally an identical part made of a different material, is plug and play.

 

[07GtS197]

The only problem I see with going with say a trickflow top end is that for the price, you’re not going to be making that much power. Not many people run trickflow heads. Maybe on an all out, na, 8k rpm build it’ll make good numbers but you’ll be into it for more than what a cost of a blower and make less power. I love the idea of a big number na 2v build but I don’t think it’s the right build for the op.

 

[Snorky]

I would do aluminum block, rods, pistons, cams springs and a blower with some 3.73s. If you wanted more later. Port the heads or swap them to tfs.

 

[Makoto]

The only problem I see with going with say a trickflow top end is that for the price, you’re not going to be making that much power. Not many people run trickflow heads. Maybe on an all out, na, 8k rpm build it’ll make good numbers but you’ll be into it for more than what a cost of a blower and make less power. I love the idea of a big number na 2v build but I don’t think it’s the right build for the op.

are those VC or PFA numbers? i trust validated calculations not PFA numbers. what are big numbers? what does that even mean?

the guy wants a rebuild so using the best parts for a rebuild will get him the best result
1. the rebuild will cost money anyhow. that 4K for the tf heads/cams will not require the 1200 (or so) to refresh the stock heads so its really like $2800 + the shortblock build
2. he can throw a blower on it later if he wants even more power and he can throw forged guts in it, too.
3. that setup plus full bolt ons and gears should be stupid fun.

The question is this: do you want to have fun or brag about hp numbers and break stuff?

 

[ttocs]

not many people run trickflow heads? Between those and afr I think I know of more trickflows myself.

 

[07GtS197]

are those VC or PFA numbers? i trust validated calculations not PFA numbers. what are big numbers? what does that even mean?

the guy wants a rebuild so using the best parts for a rebuild will get him the best result
1. the rebuild will cost money anyhow. that 4K for the tf heads/cams will not require the 1200 (or so) to refresh the stock heads so its really like $2800 + the shortblock build
2. he can throw a blower on it later if he wants even more power and he can throw forged guts in it, too.
3. that setup plus full bolt ons and gears should be stupid fun.

The question is this: do you want to have fun or brag about hp numbers and break stuff?

I don’t know what you’re talking about. But when I say big numbers I’m taking north of 400 hp. Bottom line is he wants to rebuild the motor and make more power. Sure he can rebuild it with a trickflow top end but he could rebuild it and throw a base Vortech kit on it and be making more power for around the same price and have better driveability for the street. Yes better heads will make more power but at the end of the day, if he adds boost to a pi headed 2v build it’s not like he’s going to be that far behind.

not many people run trickflow heads? Between those and afr I think I know of more trickflows myself.

We’re talking about the 2v version.

 

[Makoto]

I don’t know what you’re talking about. But when I say big numbers I’m taking north of 400 hp. Bottom line is he wants to rebuild the motor and make more power. Sure he can rebuild it with a trickflow top end but he could rebuild it and throw a base Vortech kit on it and be making more power for around the same price and have better driveability for the street. Yes better heads will make more power but at the end of the day, if he adds boost to a pi headed 2v build it’s not like he’s going to be that far behind.



We’re talking about the 2v version.

A. whats the cost of a 4.6 longblock rebuild?
B. whats the cost of a blower installed?

C. whats the cost of a 4.6 longblock rebuild with the TF kit?

cause I think A + B will start creeping in on 10K FAST but then again I'm using VC numbers and you might be using PFA so idunno.

the bottom line is this, and I'm dead serious, 320+ rwhp in these cars with good gears is a riot so this bullshit about "big numbers" is just arbitrary nonsense.
it doesn't matter. why 400? why not 402? why not 398?

I'm speaking from experience in dealing with four digit hp cars and building my own cars over the years. When i see people talking about horsepower numbers on the internet its almost always purposeless arbitrary nonsensical ramblings from people who like to spend other people's money.

 

[96blak54]

Is the ego getting big in here?

 

[07GtS197]

A. whats the cost of a 4.6 longblock rebuild?
B. whats the cost of a blower installed?

C. whats the cost of a 4.6 longblock rebuild with the TF kit?

cause I think A + B will start creeping in on 10K FAST but then again I'm using VC numbers and you might be using PFA so idunno.

the bottom line is this, and I'm dead serious, 320+ rwhp in these cars with good gears is a riot so this bullshit about "big numbers" is just arbitrary nonsense.
it doesn't matter. why 400? why not 402? why not 398?

I'm speaking from experience in dealing with four digit hp cars and building my own cars over the years. When i see people talking about horsepower numbers on the internet its almost always purposeless arbitrary nonsensical ramblings from people who like to spend other people's money.

Bro you need to chill. I gave my opinion, which I still stand by, and you keep shitting on it. I’m thinking in terms of cost per hp. Most people go fi over all out na because in the end it costs less to make the same amount or more power. And a lot of supercharger kits are mostly plug and play. Some require you to send out your ecu to be flashed. Easier than a custom dyno tune that would have to be done with an na setup. Not to mention very few people tune 2v’s these days.

The 400 hp number is a generic benchmark due to most sports cars making around there nowadays. I don’t know why you took that so literally.

 

[Makoto]

Bro you need to chill. I gave my opinion, which I still stand by, and you keep shitting on it. I’m thinking in terms of cost per hp. Most people go fi over all out na because in the end it costs less to make the same amount or more power. And a lot of supercharger kits are mostly plug and play. Some require you to send out your ecu to be flashed. Easier than a custom dyno tune that would have to be done with an na setup. Not to mention very few people tune 2v’s these days.

The 400 hp number is a generic benchmark due to most sports cars making around there nowadays. I don’t know why you took that so literally.

Oh, I'm a cucumber, sir. Don't get mad, I'm showing you the validation behind my reasoning and asking how you validate yours.
I think your premise of "most hp for the buck" is flawed because it ignores the big picture.
Particularly because your recommendation for a non intercooled FI solution will never be as reliable as an NA build.

Also, the tuning argument isn't worth much given that he'll need a custom tune regardless of what he does.

Let's just try and reset: Do you have or personally built/paid for a car with the build recipe you are recommending?

Because if you have rebuilt a motor and thrown a blower on it that is pretty much plug and play for under like 6K you have my apologies and I an excited to hear the details on how to accomplish this.

 

[96blak54]

And its getting bigger!

Head gone swoll

 

[96blak54]

Lets be together and not against each other.

Simply conversate.

Intake valve area dictates hp potential. Prove me wrong

 

[Snorky]

Both of you have some valid points. I myself have done the blower and cams. Then forged the bottom end. Then added ported PI heads. I will say I wish i spent the extra thousandish on TFS heads. Would have cut down on predet. Risk under boost. Plus it out flows ported PIs with ease. Plus it eliminates the plug boss and swaps the intake valve to the other side of the cam shaft, plus better valve angles.. and wait.. is that all you say? Replaceable cam towers??! NO WAY!!! And it holds decent resale value??! Yeah right.. must be some MAGICAL head...

On paper. Boost is the cheapest easiest route to quicker power.. but those TFS heads are no joke, especially under boost. I remember back in the day y2k2gt on moddedmustangs went from ported PIs to Ported trickflows on his twin turbo car on the same boost level, same fuel and picked up some 7 mph trap speed. CrAZYYY