Is the 302 even worth building anymore

[maillemaker]

youd have to first diagnose why pressure is so low. May be something simple as valve seals.

Maybe. My point is, for cars of our vintage, it's unlikely you are going to be able to just drop a supercharger on it and send it.

And then it becomes like pulling a piece of yarn on a sweater.

Need to rebuild the heads? Well at that point might as well buy some better flowing ones. But that won't really reach its potential without a better intake. But those won't really reach their potential without a better cam. Well, if you're going that far, might as well rebuild the short block.

 

[95opal]

Maybe. My point is, for cars of our vintage, it's unlikely you are going to be able to just drop a supercharger on it and send it.

And then it becomes like pulling a piece of yarn on a sweater.

Need to rebuild the heads? Well at that point might as well buy some better flowing ones. But that won't really reach its potential without a better intake. But those won't really reach their potential without a better cam. Well, if you're going that far, might as well rebuild the short block.

Any 30 year old car will be in the same boat no matter make or model.

 

[maillemaker]

Any 30 year old car will be in the same boat no matter make or model.

I agree. So to circle back to the original poster, "Is the 302 even worth building anymore?"

Given what it's going to cost you to do it, and what you're going to put into it if you want to juice it up, it's valid to consider a modern engine replacement.

 

[95opal]

I agree. So to circle back to the original poster, "Is the 302 even worth building anymore?"

Given what it's going to cost you to do it, and what you're going to put into it if you want to juice it up, it's valid to consider a modern engine replacement.

rereading the ops original post i would say i could build a 94-95 car to camparible hp numbers of a newer swapped set up cheaper. I know cause i went threw this dilema before i started my latest build.
Budget and hp goals will always be the determining factor no matter what junk of metal you throw under the hood.

 

[maillemaker]

rereading the ops original post i would say i could build a 94-95 car to camparible hp numbers of a newer swapped set up cheaper. I know cause i went threw this dilema before i started my latest build.
Budget and hp goals will always be the determining factor no matter what junk of metal you throw under the hood.

It would be interesting to see your cost breakdown comparison numbers.

 

[Terrorist 5.0]

I don’t think it is a matter of power. You could swap in countless motors into these cars, but remember one thing.

The song is “rollin’ in my 5.0”, not in my LS, or my Coyote.

The 5.0 is what made these cars really special. Other than that, sure they look cool, but looks are subjective. I’m sure there is someone out there that thinks the Pontiac Aztec is the coolest car ever. That doesn’t make it remotely comparable to a Mustang, does it?

Apart from the engine, although I love these cars and am perfectly content with nearly every imperfection, they are piles of garbage compared to other cars of the time. Undeniable. The 5.0 made the Mustang.

 

[bennylava]

A dart block isnt that much money and will support whatever you throw at it.

I'm probably in the minority in this opinion. But that's not even a ford anymore. That's just some other company using ford's specs for the bore size and bolt hole locations. To me that takes all the fun out of it. I kinda want to beat their chevy with a ford. That's what attracts me to the godzilla, the only thing you would do is put an aftermarket supercharger on it.

This is what most "car shows" look like across North America in 2025. Trust me you're out of the loop and "need to respect all builds bro".

This is what wins trophies now.

Nah that's just not a car show I would ever go to. The ones I go to are specific. For instance we have a show in my town where 1969 is the latest model accepted. You're not allowed to bring some dodge throwaway car with dolls on it lol. Then there's the mustang only shows.

It looks like you're going to some crap that idiots put together and called it a "car show".

There is a truck show I like to go to, and it never fails there's a few goofballs that think someone is actually interested in their 2024 F150 or 2022 Dodge ram. They sit there with nobody around, with all the doors and the hood open. Or the bro dozers where everybody knows all they did was waste a ton of money to hurt the truck's capabilities. But it's probably 90% cool trucks so I still like to go.

 

[bennylava]

Keep in mind the LS1 is not only a significantly bigger engine than the 302, but also way newer design wise. The 302, as much as I think it is awesome, it stuck around for way too long.

It’s what Ford does. When they hit a home run, they are the best at just sitting on it until they can’t anymore. Although come to think about it, the LS1 came out in 97/98. At that point the 302 was only in the Explorer, and the Camaro competitor was the Cobra at the time.

If I am correct, that would mean the LS1’s main competitor was the 4V. Pretty even match I would say, especially with a ring and pinion upgrade for the 4V.

My point is, it’s not fair to compare the 302 against the LS1, as they were not meant to be competitors. You could compare the Cobra’s GT40 302 to the LT1 that came in the Camaro at the time, and find that they were somewhat competitive with each other, but the Camaro has always made more power. Much bigger engine.

If Ford ever stuck a GT40 351 in the Cobra (a normal Cobra not the Cobra R), then the LT1 would have had a real run for its money.

That's all true if we want to make sure everything is filed away nicely in hyper segmented, separate classes. Even though we already have the class of "pony car" or "muscle car" that all the rear wheel drive 2 door v8's would fit into. It was very common in those days to have a 1995 GT (or cobra) vs the camaro that was only 2 years newer, and it would get beat very badly. To me 2 years newer is definitely the same...everything. You're in the same era. It's not like putting the last GT500 against one of those camaros, where the camaro could never stand a chance and it should be obvious as to why.

It's within 2 years of direct competition, which would be the Mustang GT vs Camaro Z28. Even the cobra that you mentioned from 97 or 98 wouldn't match a car that was 1 tier below it, a Z28. The cobras were what, 80 hp less for about 6 years until 2004, by which time the camaro was dead.

 

[07GtS197]

A Godzilla swap would be badass but the purist in me would rather put a stroked 351w in there instead.

To me, the 96+ get the coyote/godzilla pass because there really isn’t much you can do na to make the 2v fast. Plus it’s already equipped with things like hydroboost and a trans that’ll bolt to it making it a little simpler. At the end of the day it’s your car, you do what you want. Don’t worry about anyone else’s power numbers.

 

[bennylava]

Maybe. My point is, for cars of our vintage, it's unlikely you are going to be able to just drop a supercharger on it and send it.

And then it becomes like pulling a piece of yarn on a sweater.

Need to rebuild the heads? Well at that point might as well buy some better flowing ones. But that won't really reach its potential without a better intake. But those won't really reach their potential without a better cam. Well, if you're going that far, might as well rebuild the short block.

And if you're going that far, just save a lot of time and order a crate engine off summit. Time is valuable too, and the crate engine will save you a ton of time and gas for various short trips. So that's why I'm thinking the 302 is hardly worth doing anymore. Unless for some reason, you already had all the parts on hand, or you could get them at deep discounts. 50% off or greater. That would knock enough of a dent it the price to justify it.

 

[duh09]

I swear I get dumber everytime I open this thread.

 

[I_LIKE_TURTLEZ]

I swear I get dumber everytime I open this thread.

 

[Terrorist 5.0]

A Godzilla swap would be badass but the purist in me would rather put a stroked 351w in there instead.

To me, the 96+ get the coyote/godzilla pass because there really isn’t much you can do na to make the 2v fast. Plus it’s already equipped with things like hydroboost and a trans that’ll bolt to it making it a little simpler. At the end of the day it’s your car, you do what you want. Don’t worry about anyone else’s power numbers.

Agreed, nobody should be swapping 94-95’s to modular based engines. Completely defeats the point of being a 94-95

 

[Terrorist 5.0]

That's all true if we want to make sure everything is filed away nicely in hyper segmented, separate classes. Even though we already have the class of "pony car" or "muscle car" that all the rear wheel drive 2 door v8's would fit into. It was very common in those days to have a 1995 GT (or cobra) vs the camaro that was only 2 years newer, and it would get beat very badly. To me 2 years newer is definitely the same...everything. You're in the same era. It's not like putting the last GT500 against one of those camaros, where the camaro could never stand a chance and it should be obvious as to why.

It's within 2 years of direct competition, which would be the Mustang GT vs Camaro Z28. Even the cobra that you mentioned from 97 or 98 wouldn't match a car that was 1 tier below it, a Z28. The cobras were what, 80 hp less for about 6 years until 2004, by which time the camaro was dead.

The model years are the same, but the Camaro’s powertrain was light years ahead of the Mustang’s at the time (94-95). Not only did they have LS engines in the later ones, but they also got a T56 instead of a T5. You could find T5’s in Chevy S10’s, can you say the same about a T56?

The Cobra was the competitor to the Camaro, and the 4V especially held its own. Probably wouldn’t beat the Chevy, but would be a close race. The GT was in a class of its own, Ford had their own niche with the GT and knew that they didn’t have to do anything and they would still sell.

 

[bennylava]

I swear I get dumber everytime I open this thread.

Well we told you to stop smoking that stuff while you're browsing! We need you at full capacity

 

[Snorky]

A Godzilla swap would be badass but the purist in me would rather put a stroked 351w in there instead.

To me, the 96+ get the coyote/godzilla pass because there really isn’t much you can do na to make the 2v fast. Plus it’s already equipped with things like hydroboost and a trans that’ll bolt to it making it a little simpler. At the end of the day it’s your car, you do what you want. Don’t worry about anyone else’s power numbers.

2v na needs tfs heads and cams for 350 whp. 4v NA you need cams to hit that. A 5.4 LS would need something like 799 heads and a cam to make the 400-440 range.

None of them are really "impressive " for the money. It is what it is working with naturally aspirated dinosaur technology and not an enormous engine like a 6.0L +

 

[ttocs]

Well we told you to stop smoking that stuff while you're browsing! We need you at full capacity

you make it sound like a bad thing?

 

[Snorky]

Agreed, nobody should be swapping 94-95’s to modular based engines. Completely defeats the point of being a 94-95

Except for me lol I need a 94 95 so I am inspection exempt. Don't know how I would get a v10 modular swap through inspection

 

[Terrorist 5.0]

Except for me lol I need a 94 95 so I am inspection exempt. Don't know how I would get a v10 modular swap through inspection

No shame in that, gotta do what you gotta do

 

[07GtS197]

2v na needs tfs heads and cams for 350 whp. 4v NA you need cams to hit that. A 5.4 LS would need something like 799 heads and a cam to make the 400-440 range.

None of them are really "impressive " for the money. It is what it is working with naturally aspirated dinosaur technology and not an enormous engine like a 6.0L +

Exactly, they’re small displacement v8’s. It’s too costly to make decent numbers na.