PI Headswap question

[lwarrior1016]

You will be hard pressed to get the oil pump swapped out with the engine in the car. The pickup tube is in the pan and you cannott remove the pan with the engine in the car. I would go ahead and swap the chain guides and tensioner arms. Make sure you have the iron tensioners with the ratchet locks, not the plastic ones. The metal coolant tube under the intake has to be changed when you go to the pi manifold because of how deep the manifold is in the valley.

 

[white95]

You will be hard pressed to get the oil pump swapped out with the engine in the car.

If he did without dropping the K-member and using an engine cradle, I'd buy him a sammich.

 

[sk8erord]

You will be hard pressed to get the oil pump swapped out with the engine in the car. The pickup tube is in the pan and you cannott remove the pan with the engine in the car. I would go ahead and swap the chain guides and tensioner arms. Make sure you have the iron tensioners with the ratchet locks, not the plastic ones. The metal coolant tube under the intake has to be changed when you go to the pi manifold because of how deep the manifold is in the valley.

Good to know, thanks. I ordered the timing kit from MMR. So no oil pump right now, got it. Eventually I'll swap the k member, so I'll do it then perhaps.

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[lwarrior1016]

Good to know, thanks. I ordered the timing kit from MMR. So no oil pump right now, got it. Eventually I'll swap the k member, so I'll do it then perhaps.

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Awesome. post up some pictures and show us your progress along the way.

 

[sk8erord]

So given my goal of ~260-270rwhp, how far off will I be with PI head/intake manifold swap, Pacesetter longtube headers, tune? Will I need cams? The heads I got have trickflow springs and a 3 angle valve job already done to them, so I could run an upgraded camshaft in them if needed. I know it depends on other variables as well, but ballpark?

 

[white95]

You’re there with that level of modification.

 

[sk8erord]

You’re there with that level of modification.

So I don't need to spend $560 on cams? That's a relief. Where would stage 1 or 2 cams put me?

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[96blak54]

Ditch the valve springs, go back with stock. Pi valves are ment to have float and any extra spring rate takes that away. Give me your address so i can send you special lashers for the exhaust. Do you know what model the heads came from? Can you give me some head and camshaft part #'s? We'll get you over 300rwhp!

 

[sk8erord]

Ditch the valve springs, go back with stock. Pi valves are ment to have float and any extra spring rate takes that away. Give me your address so i can send you special lashers for the exhaust. Do you know what model the heads came from? Can you give me some head and camshaft part #'s? We'll get you over 300rwhp!

They are romeo PI heads, I'll have to look at them when I get home for the PN. So no benefit keeping the trickflow springs in there? I'll PM you. I need cams, followers, lash adjusters anyways. There's another guy on here I was going to buy fully assembled heads from with new lash adjusters, along with a PI manifold. I was going to rob those heads (they needed to be machined) of the cams and associated hardware for these heads. I'll PM you.

 

[white95]

So I don't need to spend $560 on cams? That's a relief. Where would stage 1 or 2 cams put me?

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I mean, it’ll sound bad ass with a set of lumpy cams but sounding mean doesn’t always mean fast

 

[sk8erord]

Ok, my head is starting to spin. Here's my parts list - what I have and what I still need:

Purchased:
PI Heads with Trickflow springs, 3 angle valve job
MMR timing chain and guides kit
Pacesetter headers and x-pipe
Ford head changing kit
Reische 170 thermostat

Parts I am buying from the forum member:
PI heads with: PI cams, lash adjusters, roller rockers
PI Intake manifold

Parts to order:
Oil Drain Plug F75Z-6730-BA
Vacuum lines (the red, brittle ones, not sure P#)
WATER PUMP - FORD (AR3Z-8501-A)
F5AZ-6700-A (1) Front Cover Crank Seal
F5RZ-6A340-B Crank Bolt
2L3Z-6584-AA Gasket Valvecover
2L3Z-6584-BA Gasket Valvecover
YL3Z-9439-BA Intake Manifold Gaskets
F1AZ 6020-C (1) Front Cover Gasket
F1AZ 6020-A (1) Front Cover Gasket
F6AZ 6020-BB (1) Front Cover Gasket
YF7Z-6279-AA (2) Cam Bolt
F1AZ-6278-A (2) Washer
F1VY-8255-A Seal- Thermostat
F1VY-8507-A Gasket Water Pump
XR3Z 18B402-AA (1) Heater Tube
XR3Z10153BC Mount Bracket (F8AZ-10153-EA (1) PI Alternator bracket)
F75Z-8555-AA coolant nipple
XR3Z-9L437-BA plenum gasket
XR3Z-9450-AA header down tube gasket

Here are the heads I bought:

 

[sk8erord]

So am I missing anything on that list? Anything I shouldn't be getting? I thought I had a handle on it, but now I'm not so sure, lol.

 

[evilcw311]

I don’t envy you mod guys. So many odd lil details and parts to worry about.


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[lwarrior1016]

I don’t envy you mod guys. So many odd lil details and parts to worry about.


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But its really not. You have to go through the same stuff if you swap some gt 40p heads on a 302. Will my intake fit, will my headers fit, will my spark plugs be at the correct angle, will my pushrods be ok, will my rocker arms work, what ratio arms can I us, will these heads actually benefit me or are they just paper weights like I know they are?

At least in a modular car, we can do a cam swap without removing the radiator.......na-na, na-na, boo-boo.

 

[lwarrior1016]

Ok, my head is starting to spin. Here's my parts list - what I have and what I still need:

Purchased:
PI Heads with Trickflow springs, 3 angle valve job
MMR timing chain and guides kit
Pacesetter headers and x-pipe
Ford head changing kit
Reische 170 thermostat

Parts I am buying from the forum member:
PI heads with: PI cams, lash adjusters, roller rockers
PI Intake manifold

Parts to order:
Oil Drain Plug F75Z-6730-BA
Vacuum lines (the red, brittle ones, not sure P#)
WATER PUMP - FORD (AR3Z-8501-A)
F5AZ-6700-A (1) Front Cover Crank Seal
F5RZ-6A340-B Crank Bolt
2L3Z-6584-AA Gasket Valvecover
2L3Z-6584-BA Gasket Valvecover
YL3Z-9439-BA Intake Manifold Gaskets
F1AZ 6020-C (1) Front Cover Gasket
F1AZ 6020-A (1) Front Cover Gasket
F6AZ 6020-BB (1) Front Cover Gasket
YF7Z-6279-AA (2) Cam Bolt
F1AZ-6278-A (2) Washer
F1VY-8255-A Seal- Thermostat
F1VY-8507-A Gasket Water Pump
XR3Z 18B402-AA (1) Heater Tube
XR3Z10153BC Mount Bracket (F8AZ-10153-EA (1) PI Alternator bracket)
F75Z-8555-AA coolant nipple
XR3Z-9L437-BA plenum gasket
XR3Z-9450-AA header down tube gasket

I would personally order a full gasket kit from ebay. You can get them for right around $100, you will easily eclipse that number buying them separately. I wouldnt worry about the cam or crank bolts either, just use what youve got already. Vacuum lines can be replace with the small vacuum hose from a parts house, it comes in a roll and you just cut to length.

What year is your car? You may not even need the nipple behind the water pump and in that case you wouldnt have to pull the pump. I wouldnt replace the water pump if its working correctly. If it goes out in the future, it takes 10 minutes to change it.

 

[evilcw311]

But its really not. You have to go through the same stuff if you swap some gt 40p heads on a 302. Will my intake fit, will my headers fit, will my spark plugs be at the correct angle, will my pushrods be ok, will my rocker arms work, what ratio arms can I us, will these heads actually benefit me or are they just paper weights like I know they are?

At least in a modular car, we can do a cam swap without removing the radiator.......na-na, na-na, boo-boo.

Takes me 5 minutes to pull my radiator. But I will agree that it’s nice to be able just pull valve covers to replace the cam................oh wait, y’all have to pay how much cause it takes multiple cams?!?! Lol

L you and I can always agree to disagree. It truly all comes down to preference. Maybe I’m just stuck liking my old school pushrods but no one can argue that they’re not simpler.


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[sk8erord]

I would personally order a full gasket kit from ebay. You can get them for right around $100, you will easily eclipse that number buying them separately. I wouldnt worry about the cam or crank bolts either, just use what youve got already. Vacuum lines can be replace with the small vacuum hose from a parts house, it comes in a roll and you just cut to length.

What year is your car? You may not even need the nipple behind the water pump and in that case you wouldnt have to pull the pump. I wouldnt replace the water pump if its working correctly. If it goes out in the future, it takes 10 minutes to change it.

It's a 96, and my new heads are romeo.

 

[sk8erord]

Is something like this what I should be looking for?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Head-Gaske...ash=item3cf3a7d2eb:g:fXQAAOSw1AZakKZV&vxp=mtr

Or should I be spending a little more like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Victor-HS5...ash=item58aab3c456:g:DpgAAMXQVERS2rJK&vxp=mtr

It's going to be a road racer, so sustained high speeds/engine RPMs for 20-25 minutes lapping sessions.

 

[lwarrior1016]

Is something like this what I should be looking for?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Head-Gaske...ash=item3cf3a7d2eb:g:fXQAAOSw1AZakKZV&vxp=mtr

Or should I be spending a little more like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Victor-HS5...ash=item58aab3c456:g:DpgAAMXQVERS2rJK&vxp=mtr

It's going to be a road racer, so sustained high speeds/engine RPMs for 20-25 minutes lapping sessions.

Victor makes good stuff. I havent built a road course car (yet), mine was a high compression drag strip car. In my case, I used the cheap kit from ebay and Honestly, I wouldnt hesitate to use it again. The only difference is really going to be the head gaskets. As long as the ones you get are MLS, you should be good to go.

Also, take a look at the coolant tube that in your engine now. I cant remember if the 96 had the correct fitting or not. I know 98 does.

 

[lwarrior1016]

Takes me 5 minutes to pull my radiator. But I will agree that it’s nice to be able just pull valve covers to replace the cam................oh wait, y’all have to pay how much cause it takes multiple cams?!?! Lol

L you and I can always agree to disagree. It truly all comes down to preference. Maybe I’m just stuck liking my old school pushrods but no one can argue that they’re not simpler.


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$560 buys two cams that dont require new push rods or lifters.

I also agree that it is personal preference and that we will continue to disagree as to which is better. I will also argue that a modular rebuild is simpler than a pushrod rebuild. When's the last time you installed a set of cam bearings? WHAT A PAIN IN THE ASS! I bet that if you ever worked on a modular engine, you would think, "this really is easier than I thought it was".