95 gt starting-electrical problem HELP!!!

Mach5Racing4 · May 28, 2007

I am having some trouble with my 95 gt 5 spd. here's whats going on, maybe someone knows what to do. thanks
ok, the other day i was backing the stang into the garage and it stalled, then it wouldnt start. so i tried turning it over with a wrench and it turned fine, so i pop started it and it runs perfect. so i figured it was the starter so i bench tested it and it was junk so i put a new one in and it is still doing the same thing (i bench tested the new one and it worked fine), i jumped the solenoid and with the key off it turned on the fuel pump and with the key on it did nothing. all the wires are well connected and clean. the ground is clean the battery is fully charged. i cant figure out what it is at all. before this it ran and started fine. has anyone ever run into this or am i missing something?? anything would help, thanks guys.also the old starter had one male spade connector and the new one had a spade and a wire with a butt connector, i figured the extra butt connector was for other models with the same starter, other than that the starters were identicle. the car has a fairly new red top optima battery. I checked all the wires with a test light and everything seems correct. i took the starter out and re-bench tested it and it was fine. the distributer is stock, 58,000 miles. it wont turn over if i turn the key it just clicks. i know the motors not seized. i jumped the clutch pedal switch and still nothing. when i connected the stater to another battery i have it will turn the engine over. but even if i jump the car it wont turn it over. i have no idea what it is. could it be the ignition and how would i test it? thanks guys i appreciate it!!
:dunno:

Fox · May 28, 2007

The first thing I would do is check out the alternator. With a volt meter, check from ground, (anywhere on the chassis with bare metal), to the positive terminal on the battery. You should read app. 14 volts.

916_5.0 · May 28, 2007

Yeah check the alt its easy and from what you said it sounds like it might be the problem.

Mach5Racing4 · May 29, 2007

i will check my alt. in a minute and see what i get. will it still get the same reading without the car running? thanks

ryclef331 · May 29, 2007

The alternator has NOTHING to do with starting your car. AT ALL. The alternator only operates when the motor is RUNNING.

First off....do you have a voltmeter? You need to ENSURE that the positive cable on the starter itself is getting 12volts. That wire is a fusible link off the fuse box. It could have fried. IF you have 12volts, I'd start looking at your ignition switch in the car. How are you jumping the solenoid? Are you running a jumper wire from the spade terminal to the positve on the battery?

Mach5Racing4 · May 29, 2007

thats what i figured about the alt. and i am going to check for 12 volts now. i jump the starter from the spade to the pos. terminal on the starter.

Fox · May 29, 2007

The alternator has NOTHING to do with starting your car.

I realize the alternator is not directly related to starting the engine, but I also realize that if you are not charging the battery, you will not start the engine. So, the statement "that it has nothing to do with it," is absurd. From past experience I would check for 14volts with the engine running and go from there.

Mach5, the rest of the troubleshooting techniques mentioned by ryclef331 is correct. Also you will read battery voltage only, with the car turned off. You should only read app. 14volts with the car running.

Fox · May 29, 2007

Mach5,

Correction on ryclef331's comment on checking the starter. You will not have 12 volts at the starter, unless you have someone turn the key and try to start the engine. The only time you will have 12v at the starter is when the solenoid gets 12v from the ignition switch. Contacts in the solenoid will close and supply 12 v to the starter and only then.

The solenoid is simply a high current relay. When you switch 12v to the coil of the solenoid, the contacts close and switch 12v to the starter.

ryclef331 · May 29, 2007

Fox said:
Mach5,

Correction on ryclef331's comment on checking the starter. You will not have 12 volts at the starter, unless you have someone turn the key and try to start the engine. The only time you will have 12v at the starter is when the solenoid gets 12v from the ignition switch. Contacts in the solenoid will close and supply 12 v to the starter and only then.

The solenoid is simply a high current relay. When you switch 12v to the coil of the solenoid, the contacts close and switch 12v to the starter.

NO 12volts at the starter? What about that BIG ASS WIRE coming from the underhood fuse box (which is directly connected to the POSITIVE ON THE BATTERY) to the BIG ASS POLE on the starter? Remember that one? That wire should have 12volts on it ALL THE TIME! I'm not talking about the spade terminal on the solenoid

As for the alternator. AGAIN, it has NOTHING TO DO WITH TROUBLESHOOTING HIS PROBLEM RIGHT NOW. A dead battery would cause his problem right now....if the battery was dead, then I'd look further as to what caused the battery to die. THEN I'd look at the alternator but dealing with the problem AT HAND, the alternator, again, has SHIT to do with starting the car.

Yet again, check that cable I mentioned earlier.

Fox · May 29, 2007

You said the alternator has nothing to do with starting the car (AT ALL). Thats not what you are saying now. You are correct. the solenoid is built into the starter, so you will have 12v on the starter at all times. Please accept my apology. ^-^.

The only case I am trying to make is this:, Why start troubleshooting backwards. Lets make sure his charging system is working properly. I have many times condemned a starter and or battery and later find out the alternator was bad. Just trying to help the guy. I don't think you need to shout. Lets look at the schematics and see if we can figure it out. I do not understand why you think the alternator is out of the picture when troubleshooting this problem.

If he has approx. 14v at the battery with engine running, then we can go on to something else.

ryclef331 · May 29, 2007

I see what you're saying. A dead battery could be causing his starting problem which would be caused by an alternator not charging...but he can't start his car to troubleshoot the alternator unless he bump starts the thing. Thats a shitty way to troubleshoot. I'm just saying, get the thing turning over first, THEN (if it IS the battery, find out what killed it).

We're on the same page...just different parts of it.

Now Mach, you said the that if you put ANOTHER battery in the car (you were putting it IN the car right?), it will start but the battery you have now reads 12volts as well? It could have a dead cell and when you put it on a load, the volts plummet.

Mach5Racing4 · May 29, 2007

the charging system was working fine but now i cant get the car started at all, the battery is fully charged and there is 12 v present at the main power wire on the starter. i think its the starter, when i connect the starter wire to the starter the engine trans and drive shaft all become positive. if i connect my test light to the frame then touch it to the engine, trans or driveshaft it lights up when the key is on. so i think the starter is grounding out and thats why its not working. i will get a new starter tomorrow and see if thats it. again thanks for all the help!

Mach5Racing4 · May 30, 2007

now the small wire on the starter is not giving me power, i checked the fuses and there good. now with the starter in the car the engine and trans are pos. when i turn the key on. where is the power for the small wire coming from? also are our cars supose to have the seperate starter solenoid on the fender wall like the fox bodies? has anyone run into any of these problems before? thanks guys i appreciate it.

Fox · May 31, 2007

The solenoid is built into the starter. I believe a starter relay is located where all the fuses are located.

ryclef331 · May 31, 2007

something isn't sending power to that wire. Back to my first post, you might have a dead ignition switch.

Mach5Racing4 · May 31, 2007

ok, thanks. ryclef is there a way to test or bypass the ignition switch?

Mach5Racing4 · May 31, 2007

anyone know how to test or bypass the ignition switch? i'm sure its something easy. thanks guys. without the help of this site i'd never get this car done!